also, Jon gets major points for this legendary pronouncement:
"You’re insane. Here is the difference between you and I — I'm a comedian first. My comedy is informed by an ideological background. There's no question about that. But the thing you will never understand - and the thing that in some respect, conservative activists will never understand, is that Hollywood - yeah, they're liberal, but that is not their primary motivating force."

quote:

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speechjew:

http://theresponseusa.com/

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I have no objections to prayer. I have prayed to God for things in the past and I have been part of group prayers and even the center of such group prayers, but this is just wrong on so many levels, even for those of faith.

If you don't believe that God exists or that he interferes with the world, you'll no doubt see this as a pointless exercise.

However, even if you do believe in God and believe that prayer reaches Him and can affect the world, this should still ring as a bad idea.

1) "The Nation will come together in Houston..."

This is so ridiculous. First of all, we can't all possibly fit in Houston. We all won't be coming together. We all aren't Christian. This is not a Christian Nation. This is as silly as CBS running a promotion that begins, "On September 26, the nation will come together to see the premier of the new season of Big Brother..."

2) Jesus warned us that those who pray the loudest and in front of an audience are the most suspect. If your faith in God is strong and you believe that He sees all, knows all, and not a moment goes by that He doesn't see, then putting on a public display is just an arrogant performance to bolster your own worth, not His. Surely, the power of prayer would be just as strong if every single person went to their own church on Sunday and prayed. In fact, why does everyone have to pray at the same place or same time?

"According to the Bible, the answer to a nation in such crisis is to gather in humility and repentance and ask God to intervene. The Response will be a historic gathering of people from across the nation to pray and fast for America."

Humility and repentance in the same act as something that is historic and grand? But, this is the same mindset that manages to simultaneously spout out that we are a Christian Nation AND that Christians are being persecuted as a minority.

3)

"we are a nation that has not honored God in our successes or humbly called on Him in our struggles."

This also always irks me. We were not founded as a Christian nation. Christianity is not the official religion. The state does not sanction Christianity. The founding fathers' religious beliefs are up for debate, but even if every single one was a diehard Christian who believed that the nation should be run as a Christian nation, so what? They also didn't believe in treating African Americans as people or giving women the same rights. They are wrong in a modern context and we must proceed with a modern context and recognize that we are a nation of multiple faiths and backgrounds. Last I checked, there are slightly more women than men, so they could claim this is a Woman Nation and that men are just those other people who live in the country of women. But, that would be patently ludicrous.

I can't believe that this guy might have a chance at grabbing some political power.

__________________
There are two rules for success:

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Originally posted by revenger:
Pardon my ignorance, but is it possible the U.S. can lower gas prices to around $2 or so? $2.09? -Revenger

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then the big oil companies making huge profits wouldnt be making as much profit. and that means they have less $$ to give to the politicians in their pockets. (you can swap 'politicians' for 'republicans' if you want, i dont think anyone will argue). Oh, and something about government regulation being bad. so we're just going to keep paying $3.80ish, because we all have to get to work somehow.

__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

quote:

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Originally posted by thror:
then the big oil companies making huge profits wouldnt be making as much profit. and that means they have less $$ to give to the politicians in their pockets. (you can swap 'politicians' for 'republicans' if you want, i dont think anyone will argue). Oh, and something about government regulation being bad. so we're just going to keep paying $3.80ish, because we all have to get to work somehow.

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To quote a famous movie and paraphrase...

"You think that's bipartisan air you're breathing?"

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Originally posted by yakusoku:

1) "The Nation will come together in Houston..."

This is so ridiculous. First of all, we can't all possibly fit in Houston.

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The entire population of the world could fit in Texas. So... it *might* technically be possible for the US to fit in Houston. Someone'd have to crunch the numbers.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

You know what else is possible?

Instead of meeting together to pray, thousands of Christians could set aside every Sunday after going to church to donate money to their local food bank, spend time with Habitat For Humanity, and other charities that help poor people. I'm very certain that lack of medical care, obesity, heart problems, poor diet, and domestic violence are responsible for far more deaths than natural disasters and international terrorism.

Sorry, but I was raised by a Christian father who used to preach (well, not literally from a pulpit) that it's good to have faith, but you have to put your money where your mouth is and do some works. He's retired, but he spends much of his time cleaning up the neighborhood of trash, painting over graffiti, and volunteering at the local school to help them build props and sets for their underfunded performance arts department.

quote:

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Originally posted by thror:
then the big oil companies making huge profits wouldnt be making as much profit. and that means they have less $$ to give to the politicians in their pockets. (you can swap 'politicians' for 'republicans' if you want, i dont think anyone will argue). Oh, and something about government regulation being bad. so we're just going to keep paying $3.80ish, because we all have to get to work somehow.

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quote:

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Originally posted by yakusoku:
...but you have to put your money where your mouth is and do some works.

I'm living almost hand to mouth, but I just wrote a check for a non-profit organization a few days ago, I took a day off of work the other week to donate blood, and when I was unemployed, I volunteered at an organization that raised money to send poor children to summer camp so they could learn about science. Praying for good things from God is nice and all, but sometimes what you should pray for is fortitude in yourself to change the world, not that someone else will evoke the change you wish to see.

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Dude. Bro. Like sometimes we think about things we want to change. Nothing wrong with that. Sometimes thinking is just the first step. The tree is only known by its fruit. We create change only when we get up and change stuff. Like your dad and the graffiti. Get up and do, then you don't have to think about it anymore. Which allows new thoughts to form. Thoughts we've never had we learn a lot from. Eventually. I really enjoyed your post.

Thank you for that insight into a much better world.

quote:

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Originally posted by thror:
then the big oil companies making huge profits wouldnt be making as much profit. and that means they have less $$ to give to the politicians in their pockets. (you can swap 'politicians' for 'republicans' if you want, i dont think anyone will argue). Oh, and something about government regulation being bad. so we're just going to keep paying $3.80ish, because we all have to get to work somehow.

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Not to be rude, but do you actually know anything about the situation? Gas prices are what they are. We have two options: one, take them as they are (3+$), which bolsters Exxon & co's profits. The other is to reduce the cost of gasoline through subsidies - in effect, having our government eat some of the cost. This is what we have done for decades. What people don't understand is that subsidies solve nothing - Exxon et al are still making the same amount of profit, and it's still your money being spent - or, even worse, it's debt spending, meaning I'm going to have to pay for your short-sighted greediness.
Some food for thought: the united states has subsidized gas prices for decades, and has barely any alternative fuel economy to speak of. Contrast this with several european countries such as denmark and germany, who have gas prices in the area of 6 euros/liter, no subsidization, and significantly more efficient cars as well as a much more developed alternative fuel economy. Think there might be a connection there?
Honestly, if I've learned anything from US history, it's that Americans (and people everywhere, really) are collectively stubborn, stupid, and short-sighted, and they have to be dragged kicking and screaming into progress. If higher gas prices is what it takes for us to get our collective **** together and finally start seriously addressing our oil addiction, well then at least it's only 35 years late.

quote:

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Originally posted by yakusoku:
Oh fine, then. It might be possible. I'll meet you halfway and concede that it's conceivable that such an endeavor could be achieved if God intervened Himself and transported every American into one place.

You know what else is possible?

Instead of meeting together to pray, thousands of Christians could set aside every Sunday after going to church to donate money to their local food bank, spend time with Habitat For Humanity, and other charities that help poor people. I'm very certain that lack of medical care, obesity, heart problems, poor diet, and domestic violence are responsible for far more deaths than natural disasters and international terrorism.

Sorry, but I was raised by a Christian father who used to preach (well, not literally from a pulpit) that it's good to have faith, but you have to put your money where your mouth is and do some works. He's retired, but he spends much of his time cleaning up the neighborhood of trash, painting over graffiti, and volunteering at the local school to help them build props and sets for their underfunded performance arts department.

I'm living almost hand to mouth, but I just wrote a check for a non-profit organization a few days ago, I took a day off of work the other week to donate blood, and when I was unemployed, I volunteered at an organization that raised money to send poor children to summer camp so they could learn about science. Praying for good things from God is nice and all, but sometimes what you should pray for is fortitude in yourself to change the world, not that someone else will evoke the change you wish to see.

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Yak, I already had a lot of respect for you, but after this... I don't know where to begin. You're the kind of person I aspire to become.

quote:

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Originally posted by wakeupwithastory:
Dude. Bro. Like sometimes we think about things we want to change. Nothing wrong with that. Sometimes thinking is just the first step. The tree is only known by its fruit. We create change only when we get up and change stuff. Like your dad and the graffiti. Get up and do, then you don't have to think about it anymore. Which allows new thoughts to form. Thoughts we've never had we learn a lot from. Eventually. I really enjoyed your post.

Thank you for that insight into a much better world.

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Dude. Bro. Stop posting when you're stoned out of your mind.

quote:

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Originally posted by Bugger:
Not to be rude, but do you actually know anything about the situation? Gas prices are what they are. We have two options: one, take them as they are (3+$), which bolsters Exxon & co's profits. The other is to reduce the cost of gasoline through subsidies - in effect, having our government eat some of the cost. This is what we have done for decades. What people don't understand is that subsidies solve nothing - Exxon et al are still making the same amount of profit, and it's still your money being spent - or, even worse, it's debt spending, meaning I'm going to have to pay for your short-sighted greediness.
Some food for thought: the united states has subsidized gas prices for decades, and has barely any alternative fuel economy to speak of. Contrast this with several european countries such as denmark and germany, who have gas prices in the area of 6 euros/liter, no subsidization, and significantly more efficient cars as well as a much more developed alternative fuel economy. Think there might be a connection there?
Honestly, if I've learned anything from US history, it's that Americans (and people everywhere, really) are collectively stubborn, stupid, and short-sighted, and they have to be dragged kicking and screaming into progress. If higher gas prices is what it takes for us to get our collective **** together and finally start seriously addressing our oil addiction, well then at least it's only 35 years late.

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I've never ever heard anything about the US govt subsidizing gas prices. I'm pretty sure the reason prices are much higher in europe is because in those socialist countries taxes are ridiculous. Thats the only way their govts can even try to pay all their expenses.

quote:

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Originally posted by yakusoku:
Oh fine, then. It might be possible. I'll meet you halfway and concede that it's conceivable that such an endeavor could be achieved if God intervened Himself and transported every American into one place.

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Sorry you took it so seriously. It was a light-hearted remark.

quote:

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You know what else is possible?

Instead of meeting together to pray, thousands of Christians could set aside every Sunday after going to church to donate money to their local food bank, spend time with Habitat For Humanity, and other charities that help poor people. I'm very certain that lack of medical care, obesity, heart problems, poor diet, and domestic violence are responsible for far more deaths than natural disasters and international terrorism.

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I don't see why the onus is on Christians, though; the religiously-minded already give more (both of their time and their wealth) than atheists or non-practicing people do. It's unfortunate, but it seems like it's the rest of us that should be stepping up to the plate. There's a whole lot more that we could and should be doing.

But then, that might look a little too much like socialism for comfort. Or the 'big society'. Choose your poison.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

quote:

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Originally posted by andrew777:

Anyway if we actually wanted to reduce the cost of gasoline it would be easy, but it would be unpopular.

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quote:

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Originally posted by airwalk:
So how do you guys think the Artic situation is going to play out? I'm not sure how much Oil is left in the Oil Sands (supposedly, production should increase until 2020), but it's going to have to get to the point where it's not worth it anymore and America is going to be out of politcally stable oil. Will we peacefully carve it up between Denmark, Norway, USA/Canada and the Russian Federation? Or will it become much scarier?

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Well I think in the future we will have to use alternative natural gases. Interesting enough I am doing a case on a middle east company wanting to explore coal or shale gas for its gas feeds. US currently have world #1 reserve in coal and also a big piece of the Shale gas pie. Coal is a no-no in US since it is harmful to environment and shale gas is relatively new but it is a bit cheaper than coal and arguably more environmental friendly... In the future we could use natural gas vehicles and go away from gasoline...

Also it is interesting to note China has world's 3rd largest coal reserve and it has an R/P of 35 years - which more or less means that if china produces coal at its current pace it will use it all up in 35 years - of course it will be a bit less than that with increasing demand and production peak being reached way before then.. Also not all coal can be gotten (some are too deep) so china's exploring underground gasification of coal which basically means it turns coal into gas underground (hard to reach places) and collects it that way... of course if not careful it could harm the water supply...

quote:

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Originally posted by Goaswerfraiejen:
Sorry you took it so seriously. It was a light-hearted remark.

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I actually didn't take it that seriously (or at least I didn't mean to convey that tone). I meant it in the eye-rolling, smirking, shake my head, "sure, *that* could happen..." kind of sentiment. Like when my opponent rolls a 19 and tells me, "it's not unbeatable". Well, sure. There is ONE number on that die that will beat it. There's also 18 other numbers that are less than that, however.

I forget that sarcasm is both hard to read and hard to convey in the written form.

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I don't see why the onus is on Christians

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It's not on Christians. It's on anyone who complains that the world is a crappy place but won't do anything in the physical world to change it.

quote:

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Originally posted by yakusoku:
I actually didn't take it that seriously (or at least I didn't mean to convey that tone). I meant it in the eye-rolling, smirking, shake my head, "sure, *that* could happen..." kind of sentiment. Like when my opponent rolls a 19 and tells me, "it's not unbeatable". Well, sure. There is ONE number on that die that will beat it. There's also 18 other numbers that are less than that, however.

I forget that sarcasm is both hard to read and hard to convey in the written form.

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Fair enough--glad no offense was taken. FWIW, provided I didn't screw up the numbers, it looks like everyone in the world could fit in Houston with a little over two square feet to themselves (provided they find a way to stand on the water), which is presumably sufficient for prayer.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

Seems like something note worthy to mention.

.02,
Jesse

quote:

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Originally posted by ogre:
Anyone have thougts on the U.S. losing it's AAA status?

Seems like something note worthy to mention.

.02,
Jesse

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This is probably bad for the U.S. in the short term.

This might be good for the U.S. in the long term.

In the short term, the Dow Jones and Nasdaq have started dropping dramatically and there's been lots of speculation about whether this is a good thing or a bad thing for foreign investors who might be looking to pick up bonds and the like.

In the long term, this might be bad, causing problems with our debt, our appeal to foreign countries looking to invest, and with our economic recovery and unemployment problems. On the other hand, some might look at this as a good time to invest in the US, and just the one rating dip might be a good wake up for the country as a whole.

It's like a student who cruises through high school and goes to college and gets his first C ever on a midterm that makes him *really* study. There might be just a glimmer of a chance that more people will come to realize that spending can't continue to outpace revenue.

Ideally, if you work fewer hours at work, but your friends keep pressuring you to party every weekend so much that eventually you start putting everything on your credit card - your bills, your food, etc., then at some point, you're going to have to come to terms that this lifestyle is not sustainable. Start selling your unused Magic cards, eat out only on Saturdays, get a second job, and tell your friends, "I'm up to my neck in debt. If I keep going, it's going to be over my head and I'm going to drown. I need to cut back on things for awhile."

The problem is that we've "trained" politicians to give us things on credit, which we reward and we punish those that take things away from us that we feel we're entitled to have forever. You don't win elections on the campaign of "I want to reduce the size of our military by 10%, raise the age for Medicare to 70, and raise taxes by 5% for everyone, except those making over $100K, who will see an increase of 15%; in doing this, I will help balance the budget, bring us closer to avoiding deficits, and lower our national debt."

That's not what people want to hear. They want to hear that we're not going to cut any jobs, the IRS will lower taxes, and every politician will voluntarily take a 50% pay cut.

__________________
There are two rules for success:

quote:

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Originally posted by Bugger:
I'd write something clever here, but this makes me too ****ing angry. Every time I decide to give Fox News a second chance and think "nah, they can't really be subhuman pieces of scum", they prove me wrong.

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Gotta love the Daily Show.

Post-modern class warfare reminds me of ante-bellum America. When the white slave-owning class conveniently had a class of poor whites who also mis-treated blacks. In their minds, at least they weren't black. But in reality, poor whites never really had a chance of getting on the same level with the rich. The cover of race was enough to hide that poor whites were down-troddden as well. Until the industrial revolution showed that anyone (black or white) is a slave to the wealthy-class.

It doesn't surprise me that the middle-class is onboard with the notion that it's the poor who are the source of their ills. The rich have been very successful in perpetuating this. Even 2000 yrs ago, the Bible says as much:

"But you have dishonored the poor man. Is it not the rich who oppress you and personally drag you into court?"
-James 2:6

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Kyosukee

The Death Penalty
or

Don't ask Don't Tell. Take your pick. I'm curious as to opinions on both.

I ask because these are two heavily trending stories. Now I know what the twit-verse can tell me about them (them being twits, not much); I am curious as to your own experiences/opinions regarding the topics.

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I haven't been following all the details of the Davis case which has brought the death penalty to the headlines again, but there seem to be conflicting reports and agenda-drive people on both sides are likely distorting the facts. Many, but not all, of the witnesses recanted their statements, however, there was also other circumstantial evidence that I have not yet heard be refuted - ballistic reports tying Davis to an earlier conviction.

His case has been appealed and denied, so without being privvy to the nature of the courts' decisions, I can only assume that they felt that there was not enough to overturn the judgment. If the case boiled down to 9 witnesses and other circumstantial evidence and 7 witnesses' statements were excluded, then in the judges'
opinion, 2 witnesses plus other evidence still needs to be challenged.

I do not have a strong feeling one way or the other, but it seems that people who kill other people aren't thinking rationally and reasonably, so trying to use it as a deterrent won't really work.

The amount of money spent to battle appeals is comparable to the amount that would be spent to house these people for decades. I'm wary of people setting up a false dichotomy, where people on death row will either be executed or eventually released. Life in prison would have the same effect of removal from the rest of ociety. On the other hand, I understand that some feel as if it's a miscarriage of justice if murderers are allowed to die of old age.

It's impossible, in my opinion, to devise a system to appease everyone's diverse desires on this issue.

-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

I think that DADT was a ridiculous compromise, and most of the arguments I have heard for not allowing gay men and women seem contrived, easily refuted, and just ridiculous. We have a volunteer force and we are defending or fighting all around the world, and the number of highly qualified, well-trained people who were dismissed for what should be a personal matter is appalling. We don't discharge people if they get divorced, if they don't go to church (or go to the "wrong" church), if they are vegetarian, or if they don't like football. Their individual sexual preference shouldn't matter, either. Denying them because of the history of the armed forces is the same argument that people have used throughout the history of the United States to discriminate Italian and Irish immigrants, Asian immigrants and battle women's equal rights and African Americans' equal rights. The military also didn't have blood typing for transfusions, antibiotics, bullet proof vests, tanks, jet planes, and computers at certain times, but that hasn't stopped us from integrating those things into the military. If we are a stronger unit for greater inclusion, then there's no reason for exclusion beyond discrimnation.

I find it quite odd the fact that so much has been made of the possibility of sexual assault or sexual harassment if gay men were included, when there have been so many high profile cases of scores of women who have suffered the same problems. Much of this stems from ignorance, fear, and the "ick factor". The same ignorance that
prevented gay men from serving as scout leaders and clergymen under the assumption that a homosexual is equivalent to a pedophile, assumes that homosexuality suddenly means that people have no boundaries, when it comes to behaving like a normal, civilized human being. There are still MPs, JAG courts, and the like to handle when people in the military commit offenses that would normally lead to jail sentences in the civil sector.

The fear is a similar sentiment and I think it's fear of the unknown and those who feel that gay people would cause problems, but this is as silly as excluding Asian-Americans because they would all user their ninja skills to karate chop their fellow officers in their sleep.

To exclude a group because you find their personal preferences distasteful (or "icky" as I like to put it, as it puts the dislike in the right context to me) is also ridiculous, only you aren't allowed to ask about other things people do, and generally there aren't as many inquiries to whether people like to see their wives dressed up in leather, or drive an SUV with a spoiler, or put ketchup on their tuna fish sandwiches.

I like to dub it the "ick factor" because it's as childish as little boys who don't want to play ball with little girls because they wear different clothes, behave differently, and talk a different way. While they're free to do this during recess, teachers aren't allowed to make Sally sit in the back of the classroom or send her to a different classroom because Billy thinks that Sally has cooties.

If you're looking for a fairly detailed account of the Davis story and the role of eyewitness testimony, Slate has a good article here.

On DADT: What yakusoku said. Discriminating against people on the basis of sexual preference is ridiculous, and what's even more ridiculous is that laws like DADT or the ban on open homosexuality in the military only end up rewarding the bigots for their bigotry, and causing issues and uproar where there might otherwise be none.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari