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Author
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Topic: Canadian Mail Service Delays
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Malice327
Member
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posted June 02, 2011 11:26 AM
      
quote:
Originally posted by joz:
Then damn the ... err.....customs ? Something is slowing down the mail...
Customs has always had a chance to slow down mail. Usually it slows down us -> canada and not the other way around though
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airwalk
Member
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posted June 02, 2011 01:38 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Heresy19:
I hate them :PThey make twice my salary (I actually think it's closer to 3x), have a great future, etc... and yet, they want more and more and more... I love my union-free job ''you don't like your salary or working hours? Go get another job then''  Great-West have all I need if I ever get sick/injured.
They don't want more and more, they want to keep what they have -- this is par for the course when you work for the Government, every time your collective agreement ends you have to fight to keep what you had before. This year my union lost our severance pay and in return we get a free one time use vacation day, awesome deal, eh? It's also fine that they get payed a good wage, they deserve it. Canada Post actually turned a profit every year for the last 15 years! Quite amazing when you think about how few people their are in this country and the logisics behind sending parcels around the 2nd lagest country in the world. Anyway, I have a feeling they will reach an 11th hour agreement, as is tradition.
[Edited 3 times, lastly by airwalk on June 02, 2011]
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WeedIan
Member
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posted June 03, 2011 07:58 AM
  
Update on this, they are doing rolling strikes not a country wide strike.__________________
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MTDetermine
Member
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posted June 03, 2011 09:12 AM
quote:
Originally posted by airwalk:
It's also fine that they get payed a good wage, they deserve it. Canada Post actually turned a profit every year for the last 15 years! Quite amazing when you think about how few people their are in this country and the logisics behind sending parcels around the 2nd lagest country in the world.
Their rates are more expensive than USPS in America. You can get Express Mail for $30 from USPS but Canada Post will charge you closer to $80. It costs around $3 to ship 10 cards from USA to Singapore via normal mail. Using Canada Post, it is closer to $5. I do agree on "an expensive post office is better than no post office at all".
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airwalk
Member
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posted June 03, 2011 01:34 PM
I'd say it has to be expensive, it costs me the same amount of money to send an envelope 50km's as it does to send it thousands and thousands of kilometres to the most isolated parts of Canada. In order to have a system like this where basic mail is cheap to every part of the country they have to charge more for other services which aren't used as much. I don't think CanadaPost would ever be able to compete with USPS on a cost/service basis and still stay out of debt, unless our population suddenly increased ten-fold.
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caquaa
Member
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posted June 04, 2011 06:12 AM
quote:
Originally posted by MTDetermine:
Their rates are more expensive than USPS in America.
from what I recall USPS has lost money for quite a few years as well though. Kinda makes sense.
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Louisboy
Member
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posted June 04, 2011 01:24 PM
quote:
Originally posted by caquaa:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MTDetermine:
Their rates are more expensive than USPS in America.
from what I recall USPS has lost money for quite a few years as well though. Kinda makes sense.[/QUOTE]Not just lost money but lost EXCESSIVE amounts.
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Hooskdaddy
Member
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posted June 04, 2011 02:15 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Louisboy:
Not just lost money but lost EXCESSIVE amounts.
SAdly USPS has done it to themselves. If they would get with the times and update their practices, add a few services that the big named places offer (UPS, Fedex, etc) they could compete better. They are essentially delivering 2012 mail in a 1950s custom.
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rockondon
Member
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posted June 04, 2011 05:29 PM
I see canadapost workers as people who scored a well-paying job with no education requirements and they happen to have some power thanks to the near-monopoly that canadapost has in mail delivery in canada. And from what I've read the strike isn't about keeping what they had, its mostly about increasing wages. Purolator is an alternative delivery service that is unaffected by the strike. Not sure how much more expensive it is. __________________
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Volcanon
Member
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posted June 04, 2011 05:45 PM
quote:
Originally posted by rockondon:
I see canadapost workers as people who scored a well-paying job with no education requirements and they happen to have some power thanks to the near-monopoly that canadapost has in mail delivery in canada. And from what I've read the strike isn't about keeping what they had, its mostly about increasing wages. Purolator is an alternative delivery service that is unaffected by the strike. Not sure how much more expensive it is.
No, it's about keeping what they have. And the whole "omg a job that doesn't require years of education pays well! For shame!" line wears thin. There's other, more valid ways to say you don't like what they are doing. Try those.
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rockondon
Member
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posted June 04, 2011 07:09 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Volcanon:
No, it's about keeping what they have.
So I keep hearing, from people who have yet to validate such claims. I won't hold my breath waiting for those claims to be backed up though, its no secret what the strike is really about... quote:
At a time when Canada Post has seen a 17-per-cent drop in mail volumes over the past five years, the union is seeking wage increases.link
quote:
At issue are wages, especially for new hires, as well as sick leave, pensions and technological changes.link
quote:
The union and Canada Post have been negotiating for more than seven months mainly over wages, benefits and working conditions. The union wants a four-year contract and wage increases of 3.3% in the first year and 2.75% in years two and three.link
It would seem they want wage increases, and changes in sick leaves, pensions, and technology.
quote:
And the whole "omg a job that doesn't require years of education pays well! For shame!" line wears thin. There's other, more valid ways to say you don't like what they are doing.
lol, you can go back to saying 'they want what they already have' over and over now. __________________
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WeedIan
Member
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posted June 04, 2011 07:53 PM
Don't those wage increases just account for inflation?__________________
Member Since 03/28/2001
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Volcanon
Member
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posted June 04, 2011 08:06 PM
quote:
Originally posted by rockondon:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Volcanon:
No, it's about keeping what they have.
So I keep hearing, from people who have yet to validate such claims. I won't hold my breath waiting for those claims to be backed up though, its no secret what the strike is really about... quote:
At a time when Canada Post has seen a 17-per-cent drop in mail volumes over the past five years, the union is seeking wage increases.link
quote:
At issue are wages, especially for new hires, as well as sick leave, pensions and technological changes.link
quote:
The union and Canada Post have been negotiating for more than seven months mainly over wages, benefits and working conditions. The union wants a four-year contract and wage increases of 3.3% in the first year and 2.75% in years two and three.link
It would seem they want wage increases, and changes in sick leaves, pensions, and technology.
quote:
And the whole "omg a job that doesn't require years of education pays well! For shame!" line wears thin. There's other, more valid ways to say you don't like what they are doing.
lol, you can go back to saying 'they want what they already have' over and over now. [/QUOTE] Way to quote an editorial. Do you often quote opinion pieces for fact? This is what the union says. Sure, take it with a grain of salt but:
http://www.cupw.ca/index.cfm/ci_id/12578/la_id/1 From what I see, management wants:
(1) Worse sick leave
(2) Reduced injury pay.
(3) Worse retirement health benefits.
(4) Worse night recovery leave, whatever that is.
(5) No more "pay by route", instead, "pay by hour". So no incentive to work quickly and generally a beefy pay cut.
(6) Permit supervisors to perform work of the bargaining unit.
(7) Weaker grievance procedure.
(8) Generally other weaker union rights.
(9) Less vacation leave for employees without three decades of service.
(10) Eliminate the right of temporary employees to obtain regular employment based on seniority. CPC wants to be able to by-pass current temporary employees and hire directly from the street.
(12) Job security: establish weaker job security protections.
(13) Wages: Reduce the entry level wage rate.
(14) Working time: introduced reduced vacations, eliminate wash-up time, eliminate the paid meal period and eliminate special leave and night recovery leave.
(15) Pensions: Implement a defined contribution pension plan.
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rockondon
Member
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posted June 05, 2011 12:08 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Volcanon:
Way to quote an editorial. Do you often quote opinion pieces for fact?This is what the union says. Sure, take it with a grain of salt but:
http://www.cupw.ca/index.cfm/ci_id/12578/la_id/1
In one breath you insinuate that the sources are biased (even the Globe and Mail isn't good enough for you?) and in the next breath you link to the union's interpretation of their opponent's position. Do you also rely on democrats to explain the position of republicans and creationists to explain evolution? quote:
Originally posted by Volcanon:
No, it's about keeping what they have.
According to the union's own website (if you would like to insinuate their own website is biased against them too, please feel free) they have a full page of changes that they want made, including wage increases. Lets put things in perspective.
People with no education or relevant experience can get hired on canadapost and make ~40k/year to start with 7 weeks vacation, great benefits and pension...and they're going on strike.
Its the kind of job most people dream of. Some people are just spoiled, and the rest of us suffer for it. Let them strike. I'm sure half the country would love to have their jobs.
__________________
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Atahualpa
Member
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posted June 05, 2011 01:51 AM
Why complain about Can Post employee wages and benefits and seek to worsen those employees' situations? Why not fight to give other people similar pay and benefits? There is certainly enough wealth in this country that we can afford to extend similar benefits and salary to others.The middle class in shrinking rapidly because of this spiteful, jealous demand to rob people of a decent living wage and benefits. Shouldn't a Toronto-based postal worker be able to eventually afford a home in the city? Why shouldn't hard working blue collar workers be able to at least follow in the footsteps of those before them and live a reasonable middle-class life in contemporary Canada. Next time you hear a person complain that a public or unionized employee has a better salary or better benefits than someone in a similar private sector job, don't let yourself get dragged into the belief that they are over paid. Instead, recognize that many in private sector jobs are woefully underpaid with poor benefits that leave them tenuously close to being jobless in a time of crisis. We, as a society, should be fighting to improve private sector wages and benefits. We should be working to bolster and even restore the disappearing middle class. Better government regulation and a return to a more progressive taxation scheme would go a long way. So too would support for unionization where employees seek it. If Canada Post is a failing institution due to reduced demand for services, then so be it. The workers will have to decide if fighting to keep their current situation will come at the cost of the viability of the service at large. If they guess wrong, they will suffer for it. However, it seems clear to me that the problem with Can Post is not the wage structure of its employees. The real issue is reduced demand decreasing the value of each route in revenue. Asking workers to do the same jobs for less (or below COLA wage increases) or for greatly reduced benefits seems unfair to me when the management hasn't put forward other changes to address the root causes of the increased cost to revenue ratio. There are plenty of other options the service could consider (e.g. reduced service, fee-by-distance/fuel use surcharges). There was a time when Toronto had thrice daily postal delivery -- times change and the service can change to meet them.
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MTDetermine
Member
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posted June 05, 2011 08:27 AM
Now that I get a better idea of the reason for Canadian Post office high rates, I can better accept it. In many countries with relatively high per-capita income, the middle class is shrinking pretty fast due to:1) Effective outsourcing of jobs by relocating operations to cheaper countries
2) Increased hiring of cheap foreign workers to take over white collar jobs (Not all Indians hired in USA are elite software writers, many are simply doing run-of-the-mill IT jobs)
3) Opening the floodgates to cheap foreign workers who just want to make a fast buck and go back home in a few years' time
The key reason to 1), 2), 3) is that there are a lot of people in BRIC and other developing countries who are more than happy to earn 50-70% of the wage commanded by the average worker in developed countries. The only thing a citizen in a developed country can hope for is that their government will have the conscious to:
A) Limit entry to foreigners who are really exceptionally talented (eg: engineer that Google wants to hire) or foreigners who are doing menial jobs that locals never want to do (eg: maybe the local sewage plant?) B) Do check on every foreigners to ensure that their listed education qualifications are real and not fakes (you will be surprised by the number of people from BRIC who are willing to fake their educational qualifications).
Unfortunately, most governments are terrible at A) and B), the only question is which government is least terrible. So in developed countries such as Canada/USA/Singapore, locals will just have to bear with a constantly eroding middle class!
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Volcanon
Member
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posted June 05, 2011 02:42 PM
quote:
Originally posted by MTDetermine:
Now that I get a better idea of the reason for Canadian Post office high rates, I can better accept it. In many countries with relatively high per-capita income, the middle class is shrinking pretty fast due to:1) Effective outsourcing of jobs by relocating operations to cheaper countries
2) Increased hiring of cheap foreign workers to take over white collar jobs (Not all Indians hired in USA are elite software writers, many are simply doing run-of-the-mill IT jobs)
3) Opening the floodgates to cheap foreign workers who just want to make a fast buck and go back home in a few years' time
The key reason to 1), 2), 3) is that there are a lot of people in BRIC and other developing countries who are more than happy to earn 50-70% of the wage commanded by the average worker in developed countries. The only thing a citizen in a developed country can hope for is that their government will have the conscious to:
A) Limit entry to foreigners who are really exceptionally talented (eg: engineer that Google wants to hire) or foreigners who are doing menial jobs that locals never want to do (eg: maybe the local sewage plant?) B) Do check on every foreigners to ensure that their listed education qualifications are real and not fakes (you will be surprised by the number of people from BRIC who are willing to fake their educational qualifications).
Unfortunately, most governments are terrible at A) and B), the only question is which government is least terrible. So in developed countries such as Canada/USA/Singapore, locals will just have to bear with a constantly eroding middle class!
Canada Post is expensive because of the size of the country relative to population much more than wages. It's expensive to hold thousands of kilometres of useless arctic land
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Ippon
Member
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posted June 05, 2011 03:30 PM
The main sticking point for the union and I have two relatives that are in that union is they are trying ti take away the pay per route and switch to a pay per hour as well as taking away sick time and replacing with a new system. Basically postman who could finish their route in 5 hours could leave and still get their full pay. CP wants to only pay for hours worked now so in effect that's like a 40 percent pay cut for those on weaker routes. They've had the system for 40 years and aren't likely to give it up easily. The other point is losing their sick time and moving to a short term disability system which would require Doctors notes/visits every time you are sick.
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Devonin
Member
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posted June 05, 2011 03:35 PM
I feel a little like the idea is supposed to be that an 8-hour route is supposed to take you 8 hours, and while it's true currently that on light mail days, for example you might get that route done in 6 hours, and it sucks that you'd lose two hours of pay, if you weren't being actively rewarded for speeding through your delivery as quickly as possible, we might have fewer instances of mail ending up at the wrong houses all the time. I've lost count of how much mail for not us has arrived in our clearly marked mailbox at our clearly marked house.
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Mr.C
Member
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posted June 14, 2011 11:10 PM
And it looks like Canada Post is shut down, for now:http://clients.infopost.ca/en/ __________________
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WeedIan
Member
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posted June 15, 2011 12:21 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Mr.C:
And it looks like Canada Post is shut down, for now:http://clients.infopost.ca/en/
Ugh no fun! __________________
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Mr.C
Member
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posted June 15, 2011 01:01 AM
quote:
Originally posted by WeedIan:
Ugh no fun!
Tell me about it. I was going to pick up some cards from T&T, and now I can't. Sucks. __________________
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WeedIan
Member
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posted June 15, 2011 01:29 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Mr.C:
Tell me about it. I was going to pick up some cards from T&T, and now I can't. Sucks.
Some people from my area were just going to make a bulk SCG order as well. __________________
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potaguitar
Member
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posted June 15, 2011 10:14 AM
I literally just made a deal with a Canadian trader yesterday and was planning on sending out today. Should we both wait until the strike is over to send? What will happen to the mail if it's sent out right now?
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airwalk
Member
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posted June 15, 2011 11:42 AM
quote:
Originally posted by potaguitar:
I literally just made a deal with a Canadian trader yesterday and was planning on sending out today. Should we both wait until the strike is over to send? What will happen to the mail if it's sent out right now?
Don't put anything in the mail to Canada right now.
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