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Author
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Topic: Sales, Better Same Worse on MOTL
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slurpee
Member
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posted November 12, 2014 12:17 PM
        
I really have had a tough 2014 for real life stuff, and have not had the time to devote to cards that I normally do and as such I haven't really analyzed sales in a while.In general are you seeing more sales on MOTL, same or worse. Only in terms of MOTL and not ebay or other websites. My own short term observations are: the euro is down quite a bit so I haven't seen a lot of the Euro market recovering. tcgplayer has taken a chunk out of things. I find I am mostly supplying stores with inventory and less individual sales. Please share your own experiences. I don't need a critique as to my price on a certain card or if you don't like me personally.
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mm1983
Member
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posted November 12, 2014 12:26 PM
On primarily standard stuff and newer/brand new sets I've found that I have to be cheaper than anybody on TCGplayer to be able to sell here on MOTL so as long as I am below the cheapest TCGplayer listing I can get some sales done. If you are selling Modern stuff you can probably get away with being around TCG mid prices. Legacy/Vintage market here is kinda just name your own price as you are most likely the only person selling those items.
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hilikuS
Member
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posted November 12, 2014 12:58 PM
I had been slowing down for a long time, but finally pulled the plug on my list in like May or June (can't remember specifically). Yours and MAB's lists were always larger than mine, but I would get a decent chunk of hits back a couple years ago. Same with MTG Salvation, which actually completely died off when they upgraded the website. I went from maybe 85-90% as much business there as I did here to almost 0. Super sucked.I agree with you on the Euro, the European guys used to buy a lot more frequently, and for big dollars. It was sweet. That was definitely one of the best perks of doing business here. You can reach people from other countries. Not to mention the dealer site reps that were running around for awhile. That was awesome. I am often wondering why I didn't start with TCG earlier though, as it is so much faster. I lose out a percentage on everything, but I move crap so it evens out to me. Having more cash on hand is worth the hit. I also don't have to deal with Paypal, which is actually super nice. Eventually I figure I can ask for a better price on my stuff with enough cred. It also ends up being quite a bit less work too.
[Edited 2 times, lastly by hilikuS on November 12, 2014]
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DerangedHermit
Member
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posted November 12, 2014 09:10 PM
I think we've gotten to the point that the lack of any upgrades to MOTL has rendered it a dinosaur.
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paragondave
Member
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posted November 12, 2014 09:14 PM
unfortunately and for obvious reasons, it's much worse than back in the good old days.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by paragondave on November 12, 2014]
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oneofchaos
Member
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posted November 12, 2014 10:41 PM
I think selling/speculating got a lot tougher in the past couple years with the constant reprints. It's definitely got me doing less wheeling and dealing. I get busy with work and life and realize since I'm not a full time dealer my stuff plummets more often than it grows.
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jaromirjagr
Member
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posted November 13, 2014 12:19 AM
Ive found that there is no true leader in sales like there used to be like mabrapper,gunslinga,slurpee,etc.Those 3 sellers have gotten out of the game or and on the way out,hence not replenishing stock.All I see is flash in the pan standard cards nowadays and there is a fair bit for sale if that's what youre into.Ive had to resort to ebay and facebook groups for specific stuff for my edh homebrews.I guess if anyone would want to start a store on here now would be the time as theres no true winner here.
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Christof
Member
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posted November 13, 2014 12:20 AM
I still get some trades done.But with pucca trade, it's alot easier to move crap than anywhere else.
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paragondave
Member
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posted November 13, 2014 02:15 AM
quote:
Originally posted by jaromirjagr:
Ive found that there is no true leader in sales like there used to be like mabrapper,gunslinga,slurpee,etc.Those 3 sellers have gotten out of the game or and on the way out,hence not replenishing stock.All I see is flash in the pan standard cards nowadays and there is a fair bit for sale if that's what youre into.Ive had to resort to ebay and facebook groups for specific stuff for my edh homebrews.I guess if anyone would want to start a store on here now would be the time as theres no true winner here.
not sure about Mab, but Slinga and slurpee (lol, the OP) both currently have active sales threads. They're still hogging up all the buyers! 
[Edited 1 times, lastly by paragondave on November 13, 2014]
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ravidell
Member
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posted November 13, 2014 04:00 AM
I have always hated selling on MOTL. You post a good fair price and everyone still wants to beat you up over it and low ball you. I do not have time to sift through posts of "bla bla bla card $10. --> $6."
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Child of Gaea
Member
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posted November 13, 2014 04:26 AM
Yet another example of this sites mismanagement causing its inevitable decline. Proud nouveaux?
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AGO
Member
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posted November 13, 2014 05:20 AM
quote:
Originally posted by hilikuS:
I had been slowing down for a long time, but finally pulled the plug on my list in like May or June (can't remember specifically). Yours and MAB's lists were always larger than mine, but I would get a decent chunk of hits back a couple years ago. Same with MTG Salvation, which actually completely died off when they upgraded the website. I went from maybe 85-90% as much business there as I did here to almost 0. Super sucked.I agree with you on the Euro, the European guys used to buy a lot more frequently, and for big dollars. It was sweet. That was definitely one of the best perks of doing business here. You can reach people from other countries. Not to mention the dealer site reps that were running around for awhile. That was awesome. I am often wondering why I didn't start with TCG earlier though, as it is so much faster. I lose out a percentage on everything, but I move crap so it evens out to me. Having more cash on hand is worth the hit. I also don't have to deal with Paypal, which is actually super nice. Eventually I figure I can ask for a better price on my stuff with enough cred. It also ends up being quite a bit less work too.
I also moved my entire list to TCG player. I have filled over 300 orders in the past month. MOTL just became a hassle. People would make low ball offers then it would take 4 days to finalize the sale then another day to receive payment. Now that I use TCG all I have to do is wait, print off order slips, package, and send. I don't have to keep track of my inventory manually. If it sells it is taken off my list. I have also started selling playsets on Ebay which I wish I started years ago. I'm making twice as much there then I could possible make here. Sorry to say it but you're just grasping at straws thinking MOTL has a chance in hell at staying alive. By the time we get an update everyone else is going to be established somewhere else. An update to the search and price guide just won't cut it anymore. The entire site needs an overhaul to survive. They only thing keeping it alive now is a small community holding on to what was.
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Tha Gunslinga
Moderator
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posted November 13, 2014 06:54 AM
There are a number of reasons why sales on MOTL are way down. It's not just a lack of updates to the site, though that is one reason.
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rats60
Member
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posted November 13, 2014 07:26 AM
quote:
Originally posted by ravidell:
I have always hated selling on MOTL. You post a good fair price and everyone still wants to beat you up over it and low ball you. I do not have time to sift through posts of "bla bla bla card $10. --> $6."
This. I posted a list of my extra stuff that I wanted to move and priced it all below tcg player. I had lots of people post that they would take this or that, but only about half followed through. I had someone want to buy it all. We agreed on a percentage, then when I figured the total, he backed out. I think that most of the players have left and only the sharks are left. It is one thing to try to give someone a good deal, but when it is easier to sell on ebay/tcg player and now you are making more doing so, it is no wonder this site is dead.
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psyduck_dude12
Member
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posted November 13, 2014 08:25 AM
Sales died off for a few reasons imo1) tcgplayer opening up the sales feature to individuals
2) a fair amount of sellers offering prices 5% off SCG which turns off buyers and buyers offering under buylist which turns off sellers
3) a few of the major sellers leaving the forums
4) time it takes to get a deal done
5) dates website
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hilikuS
Member
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posted November 14, 2014 06:21 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Christof:
I still get some trades done.But with pucca trade, it's alot easier to move crap than anywhere else.
Yeah I have had pleasant experience with Puca. Usually I need random crap for EDH decks that people ask me for, and I can mash bigger things into lots of smaller things. It was startling how quickly some of the stuff would be confirmed to me once I listed it on my wants. Shipping off Cryptic Commands for a bunch of EDH fodder seems bad, but it comes at a small trade profit, and it's on demand. So I get what people need hella fast.
I do intend to rebuild my sale list though relatively soon. Seems to make sense to have my lot in more places. Doesn't cost anything to run here after all, and I can potentially move foreign stuff.
[Edited 2 times, lastly by hilikuS on November 14, 2014]
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bigballashotcaller
Member
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posted November 15, 2014 09:01 PM
I have intentionally done a lot less sales here. Speaking of the decline of MOTL in general though, Ben is right; there are a number of factors. The ones I notice most are:
1) competition on Facebook (various groups)
2) competition on TCGPlayer, once they opened it up to small sellers
3) the poor technical quality and lack of updates of this website (which I won't harp on, but is definitely a noticeable factor)I do enjoy the community here, but as others have illustrated previously, TCGPlayer does provide a nice avenue of alternate sales (which requires a fee and its own set of problems though, which no one has mentioned).
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rats60
Member
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posted November 16, 2014 09:35 AM
quote:
Originally posted by bigballashotcaller:
2) competition on TCGPlayer, once they opened it up to small sellersI do enjoy the community here, but as others have illustrated previously, TCGPlayer does provide a nice avenue of alternate sales (which requires a fee and its own set of problems though, which no one has mentioned).
This doesn't make sense to me. TCG Player is the worst. This year, I'm running over 20% of my orders having problems. I'm about ready to quit buying there. I get guys cancelling orders, sending orders missing cards, cards damaged because the seller is too cheap to invest .06 in a top load and sellers who don't have a clue about grading. My last order was for a M15 card that was supposed to be NM, but I got a card that was clearly played. At least on MOTL, I can count on most guys knowing how to grade and at least being able to get NM cards from the newest sets.
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Link139232
Member
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posted November 16, 2014 10:47 AM
I fail to see the need for a website update. The forum board is a forum board, and functions perfectly as such. I may not be aware of specific search issues (which the site could surely use an upgrade on), but when MTGSalv "upgraded" with curse, it made the site a lot laggier and harder to navigate.
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mm1983
Member
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posted November 16, 2014 11:12 AM
Price guide has not been updated since Gatecrash therefore you may only search for cards on people's lists from Gatecrash on back.
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bigballashotcaller
Member
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posted November 16, 2014 01:50 PM
quote:
Originally posted by rats60:
This doesn't make sense to me. TCG Player is the worst. This year, I'm running over 20% of my orders having problems. I'm about ready to quit buying there. I get guys cancelling orders, sending orders missing cards, cards damaged because the seller is too cheap to invest .06 in a top load and sellers who don't have a clue about grading.My last order was for a M15 card that was supposed to be NM, but I got a card that was clearly played. At least on MOTL, I can count on most guys knowing how to grade and at least being able to get NM cards from the newest sets.
That's fine, and that's your experience using it as a buyer. While I have had about a 95% plus positive experience there as a buyer (with something like a few hundred orders so far), these are both just anecdotal experiences with an extremely small sample size. What I was writing about above (in the context of the discussion of this thread) was as a seller. TCG opening up to allow everybody to sell as their own storefront is a huge boon to sellers, as it allows them another marketplace, similar to Amazon, that is structured pretty well (albeit with a fee structure), and allows them to sell for close to low retail most of the time. A lot of buyers don't like how eBay operates (in terms of having to wait and hoping you can get a card), because they like the convenience of point and click transactions, at typically lower prices than SCG/CardHaus/TrollandToad/etc. As I said, it's created competition from the seller's perspective, which is what this thread is about. There are simply more emerging marketplaces for sellers to hawk their goods, which is drawing people away from MOTL (in addition to the other factors I mentioned).
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rats60
Member
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posted November 16, 2014 02:56 PM
quote:
Originally posted by bigballashotcaller:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by rats60:
This doesn't make sense to me. TCG Player is the worst. This year, I'm running over 20% of my orders having problems. I'm about ready to quit buying there. I get guys cancelling orders, sending orders missing cards, cards damaged because the seller is too cheap to invest .06 in a top load and sellers who don't have a clue about grading.My last order was for a M15 card that was supposed to be NM, but I got a card that was clearly played. At least on MOTL, I can count on most guys knowing how to grade and at least being able to get NM cards from the newest sets.
That's fine, and that's your experience using it as a buyer. While I have had about a 95% plus positive experience there as a buyer (with something like a few hundred orders so far), these are both just anecdotal experiences with an extremely small sample size. What I was writing about above (in the context of the discussion of this thread) was as a seller. TCG opening up to allow everybody to sell as their own storefront is a huge boon to sellers, as it allows them another marketplace, similar to Amazon, that is structured pretty well (albeit with a fee structure), and allows them to sell for close to low retail most of the time. A lot of buyers don't like how eBay operates (in terms of having to wait and hoping you can get a card), because they like the convenience of point and click transactions, at typically lower prices than SCG/CardHaus/TrollandToad/etc. As I said, it's created competition from the seller's perspective, which is what this thread is about. There are simply more emerging marketplaces for sellers to hawk their goods, which is drawing people away from MOTL (in addition to the other factors I mentioned).[/QUOTE]Last year, I placed 40 orders on TCG Player and only had a problem with 1. This year it has been terrible. I was just making this observation regarding your point about collectors now selling on there. You are right about it being more convenient than ebay, but if it keeps up, it won't be. Customer service has always been a big plus for MOTL and ebay and it's worth a paying a little more than the hassle of dealing with idiots on tcg.
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paragondave
Member
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posted November 16, 2014 03:03 PM
quote:
Originally posted by rats60:
Last year, I placed 40 orders on TCG Player and only had a problem with 1. This year it has been terrible. I was just making this observation regarding your point about collectors now selling on there. You are right about it being more convenient than ebay, but if it keeps up, it won't be. Customer service has always been a big plus for MOTL and ebay and it's worth a paying a little more than the hassle of dealing with idiots on tcg.
If only the idiots stayed in one place. Alas, they are everywhere.
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hilikuS
Member
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posted November 16, 2014 05:37 PM
I've always had the same kind of negative experiences on Ebay that you're talking about with TCG Player, rats. Like, 1 outta 5 things I buy is something I have to open a case on and get a refund.For Magic at least. When I buy like shipping supplies or ink cartridges, not a problem ever. On the other side from TCG, I have found WAY less hassle with buyers too. Like, I think it has to do with that cart optimizier. Somebody's building an EDH deck, and wants half the cards, 2 of them are from you. So they're just happy to get what they ordered, no scammers like Ebay is riddled with.
quote:
Originally posted by mm1983:
Price guide has not been updated since Gatecrash therefore you may only search for cards on people's lists from Gatecrash on back.
This is also a serious problem for me. I used to use the MOTL guide religiously. It now not only is not updated, but seemingly doesn't really work the way it used to. It was "fixed" awhile ago, but worked even worse after that.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by hilikuS on November 16, 2014]
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