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Author Topic:   Christoph's Comment, July 4: Problems in upcoming Type2?
Christoph
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posted July 04, 2000 01:24 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Christoph Click Here to Email Christoph Send a private message to Christoph Click to send Christoph an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I already posted a new issue of Christoph's Comment (July 11), but this topic is still very important, so I added some comments at the bottom of this post!!!


Ok, let's start somewhere in the middle of the issue I'm going to talk about:

There have been some articles about the new environment of standard-tournaments, after the urza-block leaves us, to find his destiny in upcoming type1 and type1x competitions, but I'm going to talk about this topic once more:

The first time I thought about this problem, that is mentioned below, was a few days after I'd seen an almost complete spoiler of prophecy. I talked with a friend of mine about the high mana costs of almost all rares with good abilities. I don't have to write about the 8-mana-monsters, the avatars, everyone knows them…

I'm talking about the slowdown, which the wizards want to achieve:
There is no useful mana acceleration in the whole masques-block, except the dark ritual, because the Ramos-parts and the depletion lands aren't that helpful if you need so much mana for powerful spells.
Ok, I don't mind if it takes more turns to win a game, because it won't take more time than a replenish-mirror match…
I'm talking about a certain problem in the strategy of the wizards:
How will a slow deck be able to win against a Stompy?


Stompy has the following cards for a new deck:

Pigmy Razorback
Spore Frog
Marsh Boa
River Boa
Wild Might
Giant Growth
Seal of Strength
Invigorate
Vine Trellis
Vine Dryad

Ok, no more Cradles, no more Albinos, Wild Dogs, Rancors, but the deck doesn't have to kill in 4 turns, as it was before (because of Replenish, par example), but you don't need to: You can reduce your enemy's life very fast with the power ups, as it was before, and then use the mana you get from Llanowars (Vine Trellis and/or Birds to play that killing Vitalizing Wind. Or what about another possibility to kill: Block with Vine Trellis/River Boa and use your other creatures to attack and your Stampede Driver's ability….

The aim to make it possible, that more different types of decks are able to win a tournament, was a really good idea, but I fear, it may end in the opposite: A dominating Stompy, with no certain card that should be banned, but many commons and uncommons, that are together to strong for the environment.

A Massacre or Earthquake may help, but is this enough?

PLMK your opinion


additional comments:

Kevbob44: yes, exactly my opinion, Invasion seems to be the only possibility to destroy the domination of stompy. If you can create a deck, that beats stompy AND is not just an anti-deck, but also useful against other decks, plmk about it!


MoNkEyDnA17:

um, Ponza loses:
Avalanche Rider
Ghitu Encampment
Masticore
Lightning Dragon(if you played it,k but there is still the 2-Header)

ok, so there is still a big amount of good cards and there is a chance to beat stompy, if you play earthquake...
yes, ponza seems to be good as well.

But Stompy will always beat rebel, as I'm sure, that Lin Sivvi will be banned in Type2, if Invasion doesn't totally change the environment...


Eron the Relentless:

You're right, but never stopp creating fundecks, because one day, there will be former fundecks, that can beat the almighty stompy. Magic makes still a lot of fun, but it was better as almost everyone tried to make unique decks and not only copied popular ones....
I'm really interested if ponza can do the things MoNkEyDnA17 says....
__________________
Post by Christoph,
the trader in Germany with the most refs: www.magictraders/reflists/Christoph.html

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[Edited 1 times, lastly by Christoph on July 11, 2000]

 
Kevbob44
Banned
posted July 10, 2000 11:03 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Kevbob44 Click Here to Email Kevbob44 Send a private message to Kevbob44 Click to send Kevbob44 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Ya know Christoph, you have a very good point. I've talked with my Magic-playing friends about this problem many times. It is of course obvious that WOTC wants to slow down the cut-throat speed of decks like Bargain and Replenish, letting mana-artifacts like Grim Monolith, Thran Dynamo, et cetra slip into the Type 1 arena. Furthermore, the best cards have huge costs that will take quite some time to build up the mana and cast them. Your green stompy
is a near exact replica of the one I have constructed for future Type 2. It may very well wind up dominating the field. And the lack of a key card to ban makes the deck even more dangerous. For now, I try to construct a Mercadian-and-after deck that can beat my own. While I've had some success in doing this, I just hope Invasion (the next edition) has a few hefty surprises in store.

__________________
On guard for larger dangers,we underestimated the power and speed of the Imp's muck-crusted claws.
-Bog Imp

"Expect my visit when the darkness comes. The night I think is best for hiding all." -Ouallada (Juzam Djinn)

 
MoNkEyDnA17
Member
posted July 11, 2000 04:27 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for MoNkEyDnA17 Click Here to Email MoNkEyDnA17 Send a private message to MoNkEyDnA17 Click to send MoNkEyDnA17 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Ponza!!!

My deck will be amazing after Urza Block. I still have Stone Rain, Pillage, Seismic Mage(Squee), Tec Break, Flowstone Overseer, Dust Bowl, Port, and some decent burn. Stompy and Rebel will be the only other decks that survive, but rebel is the better of the two because green loses so much. As for rebels, 4 Brutal Suppresions is enough.

 
Eron the Relentless
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posted July 11, 2000 08:53 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Eron the Relentless Click Here to Email Eron the Relentless Send a private message to Eron the Relentless Click to send Eron the Relentless an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
good point there... sometimes you really have to wonder what wizards is thinking. They used to wiegh every option... and even made cards that would only be good in sealed deck. but now... it seems that they're just making cards that sound cool, yet won't work in a limited environment. ever time I get back into the game something makes me wonder, is the money and time worth it?? I spend so much energy making unique decks to be more fun, only to discover that it looses to a lousy stompy deck or burn n' such... Wizards better get their act togther, before the next set comes out...
 
MoNkEyDnA17
Member
posted July 11, 2000 07:54 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for MoNkEyDnA17 Click Here to Email MoNkEyDnA17 Send a private message to MoNkEyDnA17 Click to send MoNkEyDnA17 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I have a Post- Urza Ponza together right now. I went to a draft today and played it against a bunch of current decks and went something like 6-1. I think that its gonna do very well after Urza goes out. As for the losses-
Masticore- Flowstone Overseer
Encampment- Mountain
Riders- Seismic Mage/Squee
Dragon- I'll use Two Header and Overseer

As for Stompy, can you say Cave-In?

OK, I'm done for now.
P.S.- DO NOT Vendetta a Trenching Steed!!




[Edited 1 times, lastly by MoNkEyDnA17 on July 12, 2000]

 

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