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Author Topic:   Magic Counterfeit Detection Tips
inca911
Administrator
posted April 10, 2001 11:27 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for inca911 Click Here to Email inca911 Send a private message to inca911 Click to send inca911 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Hiya! I have had several folks ask me about counterfeit detection, so in the interest of helping to educate
everyone on the basics of counterfeit detection, I'm posting my tips here. Note that if you are doing third party
trades, especially for P9, you need to select an individual who is an expert at counterfeit detection to protect
yourself in the deal.

1. Card size is the same as a current card (Beta or Alpha cut and size). Just put a real card on top and check for
aberrations. Some fakes simply aren't cut to the correct size and that's all you have to check to know!

2. Card back is same coloration and clarity as a current card (fakes are often much more blurry and miscolored).
Use a regular card to check the coloration. Also closely inspect and feel the back of the card for any small
bubbles, wrinkles or roughness from a glue-on forgery.

3. Card title, card type and artist credits are crisp and clear like a current card (the title, card type and artist
credit are most blurred on fakes--more than the flavor text on the card or the card description text, perhaps
because the flavor text is black it is easier to print crisply.)

4. Card corners are nicely rounded and are not roughly cut. A die press will cut a nice clean corner, wheras a
fake that has been razor blade cut will often not have a nice clean cut. Note that the corners of a real card are
not perfectly rounded, you can look at a recent card to see the slight unrounded shape but the quality of the
corner cuts of real cards is very high.

5. I have enough experience to know the feel of the thickness of real and fake cards. Some fakes are a bit too
thick since they are actually collector's edition cards glued onto a sanded land card. If you have a caliper you
can measure the difference most times, but the feel of the card is usually off for these cards.

6. About the Bend Test: All the bend test does is to determine that the card is made of high quality cardstock.
Most high end fakes easily pass the bend test so it is worthless. Also, if you bend a real Magic card enough times
it will also crease, so don't do it!

7. About scans: Computer monitor and scan resolutions aren't usually sufficient to catch the high quality
forgeries. Typically you can't even see NM from EX condition from a scan so don't think that saves you from
forgeries!

8. More subtle info: This site is fairly good for additional counterfeit detection tips such as folks black-bordering
revised cards to pass them as Betas (check for the bevel), or folks black bordering Chronicles to pass them as
Legends (check the sword symbol and the copyright date). It's certainly worth a visit and was put together by MOTL member Twink:

http://www.rit.edu/~tpw4968/mtg/fake/

9. Card Cleaners: There are folks out there who can "restore" cards to a higher quality through artistic ability and
use of certain inks. Amazingly, these restored cards often require a scope to detect but fortunately very few
folks have this ability and knowledge. If you get cards from NY, be more careful about "restored" cards. I will not
share any more that I know about this process so please don't bother to ask!

10. Key Cards: Several years ago, a crooked printer actually ran off a ton of fakes that hit the market severely.
They included all the P9 in BB and WB, LoA, Mirror, Ali, Juzam, BB Duals, Moat, Mana Drain, Abyss, and I'm sure
others that I'm forgetting. Be careful when dealing with these older expensive cards.

I hope these few basic tips prevent some of our members from being ripped off. I also hope that increased
awareness and education regarding counterfeits make rippers avoid MOTL in general due to knowledge and
caution of it's members. Happy trading and if you need more help feel free to email me!


__________________
Wanted Summer Magic cards (finder's fee offered): armageddon clock, balance, blessing, goblin king, helm of chatzuk, millstone, mishras war machine, plateau, reverse damage, volcanic island (and maybe others you know of or can find)! I'm also interested in any other ultra-rare cards like Genesis o


[Edited 1 times, lastly by inca911 on April 11, 2001]

Magic lord
Member
posted April 11, 2001 12:33 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Magic lord Send a private message to Magic lord Click to send Magic lord an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
A printing company or an individual ran these
cards?? I work in the printing industry so
I know getting the stripped film and processing material for the prepress to make
plates to run the cards would be Illegal and nearly impossible and anyway what company would waste the paper running this product?
If you have an article or some other news source where you got the information Id love to look at it.

__________________
The mind is mightier than the pen or the sword

 
inca911
Administrator
posted April 11, 2001 05:46 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for inca911 Click Here to Email inca911 Send a private message to inca911 Click to send inca911 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
The speculation is that these fakes from a while back were professionally printed and you are correct that it is very illegal. I don't know if it is true and if I knew who or where it happened, I'd already have reported them to John Shaw over at WotC legal. I don't profess to know the printing process (BTW, I'd like to talk to you about some details in that area if you have time), but if you estimate that the plates might run as much as $10,000 - $15,000, imagine that they have the gain the ability to print cards worth a minimum of $200 each as a result! I know that the plates for printing Summer Magic cost about $30,000 and I'd think they only do one plate set and not 3 to reduce the up-front costs (typically Common, Uncommon, and Rare sheets are made and that would take 3 plate sets, wouldn't it?). They'd only have to print 75 $200 cards to break even at a $15,000 initial cost. Very scary. Please drop me an email sometime so I can learn more about the printing process. I'm married to a desktop publisher who knows a lot of info on the printing process but an actual printer's knowledge would be great.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by inca911 on April 11, 2001]
volkerii
Member
posted April 11, 2001 05:54 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for volkerii Click Here to Email volkerii Send a private message to volkerii Click to send volkerii an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
great article. I've heard some of it before but not all of it. I've also heard that if you hold a real magic card up to light long enough you start to see through it, but have never tried it. Any way thanks for the info.
 
pipeclaysh
Banned
posted April 12, 2001 07:09 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for pipeclaysh Click Here to Email pipeclaysh Send a private message to pipeclaysh Click to send pipeclaysh an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
HERE IS A REAL HELPFULL HINT PLEASE READ

ALSO you can take a drop of water and put a few drops on the actual card a REAL magic card will not absorb the water it will bead right off and wont damage the card ( drop the water in the center of the card you actually might damage the card if you get water on the side) and if you do this to a fake card the water will be absorbed and the ink will bleed and smear hope this is a helpful tip.

 
Mithra_dragon
Unregistered
posted April 13, 2001 05:43 PM   Click to send Mithra_dragon an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Thanks for the good advice it actually saved me I traded for a supposed mint beta black lotus and used a few of the tests and found that it was a little blurry on the artist name and date, I just tried the water test suggested in the post above and it did absorb the water, anyway I got to keep the card for free but it's pretty useless.

__________________
"Serra, like Feroz, is long since dead. But remember, Daria: her spirit shall survive so long as the Homelands do."

 
yeom
Unregistered
posted April 14, 2001 01:44 PM   Click to send yeom an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Thanks Inca911, I 'll have to use some of this new found knowledge in my quest for the P9.

Are the online dealers such as Cardhaus, and Troll and Toad reliable as far as P9 and oops go?

 
inca911
Administrator
posted April 14, 2001 06:45 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for inca911 Click Here to Email inca911 Send a private message to inca911 Click to send inca911 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Troll and Toad is completely reliable and that is my #1 recommended online store. The head Magic guy at T+T has forgotten more about Magic than most folks ever know. A little know fact is that a while back they sold a sealed Beta box for a WotC tournament and when the draft came all the best cards in the game ended up getting pulled from that box. I think something ridiculous like 8/9 P9 were pulled! Just more proof that those packs are not searched which is incredibly rare now a days and is a sure sign of integrity.
yeom
Unregistered
posted April 15, 2001 09:45 AM   Click to send yeom an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Can using a magnifying glass distinguish a real card from a fake card?
daddyj
Member
posted January 08, 2002 11:25 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for daddyj Click Here to Email daddyj Send a private message to daddyj Click to send daddyj an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
A magnifying glass can in some cases distinguish fakes from real cards. Especially if the cards are made from computer scans or color copiers. Usually scanners don't have enough resolution to pick up the minute pattern of the print ink and it looks blurry instead of distinct, but tiny dots. You can verify by magnifying a real card.

__________________
Never trust anyone, not even yourself.
-Cobra Commander

 
[thaurus]
Member
posted January 14, 2002 09:34 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for [thaurus] Click Here to Email [thaurus] Send a private message to [thaurus] Click to send [thaurus] an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
inca911:

thanks for the info, I have now checked my Mirror Universe. It may be a lot of fake mirrors out there, but I done all the checks, and so far, the card looks like every other magic card.

So I don't believe its fake.

- thaurus -

 
VorKaan
Member
posted January 14, 2002 10:58 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for VorKaan Click Here to Email VorKaan Send a private message to VorKaan Click to send VorKaan an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Most forgeries are easy to spot. However a neat way to check your cards is to go to a shop (such as T&T) and either have them check it for you or allow you to compare the card to one that they have from the same print run/time.
As a person who has purchased cards from almost every set (via packs mostly) I have noticed that the feel of cards before fourth edition are different (slightly) than the newer stuff. Most forgers now will print a smoother card(even for P9) whereas the origionals from UL,A,B will be slightly rougher in a single direction.
Another note is all BB cards from before legends have a small white triangle in most of the corners. (to check your beta/alpha cards) not sure why but its there.

Thank you for reading.

inca911 i applaud you for your posting of this information.

__________________
Vor'Kaan

Ask the wrong question,
and you will get the correct answer.

:send all e-mail to
raokiadan@aol.com

thanx ;>

 

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