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Originally posted by MAB_Rapper:
His attitude in general. Like, he doesn't think you are worth talking to unless you are one of his friends or rated high. He walks around thinking his is king **** when he simply is just ****.

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Ah, I see. What a shame.

The banning of Jace 2.0 does not surprise me at all. The only relevance of the banning is that it is about one year too late. The card not only warped the format but was a contagion that stifled what was once a great format to play. Pre-Jace 2.0 the standard was fun and dynamic.

Being that Jace 2.0 is being played in the eternal formats I don't think that the value will drop too much over the long run. The card is just that good.

stoneforge is still good in legacy
and equipment is still good with creatures

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Originally posted by sys41o:
Pre-Jace 2.0 the standard was fun and dynamic.

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Not to pick on you but I've heard this statement WAY to many times since JTMS has been around. Are you all on crack? Seriously? Crack?

Does anyone remember FAE? How about Jund? How about Tarmogoyf? How about Jitte? How about Affinity? Etc etc....When has Standard been fun and "dynamic"?

Are you sure you are not salty because you couldn't afford Jace? It seems so.

Jund was a nightmare! Fae was a nightmare! And don't even start with Affinity.

If anything until all the printing's of stupid equipment making SFM broken this standard was as fun and dynamic a format as there has ever been in a long long time. People only soured on it because they could not afford(or simply didn't want to spend the $) on Jace.

People bitch they had to spend upwards of $400 on a playset of Jaces...but easily forget that Tarmogoyf was a solid $250+ per playset in it's prime and this was before mythics!

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Originally posted by eXtremeEagle:
I don't remember ever hating Fae in the same way I've hated Cawblade these past months. It was a good deck, but I remember playing against a variety back then. I played B/G Elves, and there was plenty of GR Mana Ramp, 'Lark, Doran, and more. I don't think Fae had a single card on par with Jace or Stoneforge, either. Sure, Mistbind Clique was annoying but it didn't automatically get splashed into every deck playing blue. Bitterblossom is the only thing I would consider close to Stoneforge's level from that standard, and it didn't go in that many decks.

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SFM is NOT THAT POWERFUL on it's own. People please, stop posting how powerful this card is. It is good, yes, but it had to have a compliment of specific cards printed with it to make it relevant. It is not like Bitterblossom, that card is stupid and can win all by itself if left unchecked.

I know...same argument can be used against Affinity but there weren't 2-3 specific cards printed for another to be powerful...it was an entire block revolving around a specific theme(artifacts) which if history tells us anything Wizards NEEDS TO STOP! Saga, Mirrodin, and now Scars of Mirrodin, when you make blocks based around powerful artifacts you have problems. Turns out colorless spells go in every deck

I still think it's about on par with the way standard has been forever, always that one all-powerful resilient deck. FAE might not have been as powerful or as dominant as Caw-Blade but it was the top notch deck of it's time, and was very versitile and adaptive. It was a nightmare because you KNEW you were in for a lot of FAE matchups at every tourny. Sometimes I think FAE was not only better than CB but it was easier to abuse. Turn 1....Thoughtsieze, Turn 2 drop Bitterblossom....didn't matter what you did from there.

Same with Jund and Affinity, all luck as to what you cascade or draw into as to how the game would play out.

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Originally posted by daner:
Not to pick on you but I've heard this statement WAY to many times since JTMS has been around. Are you all on crack? Seriously? Crack?

Does anyone remember FAE? How about Jund? How about Tarmogoyf? How about Jitte? How about Affinity? Etc etc....When has Standard been fun and "dynamic"?

Are you sure you are not salty because you couldn't afford Jace? It seems so.

Jund was a nightmare! Fae was a nightmare! And don't even start with Affinity.

If anything until all the printing's of stupid equipment making SFM broken this standard was as fun and dynamic a format as there has ever been in a long long time. People only soured on it because they could not afford(or simply didn't want to spend the $) on Jace.

People bitch they had to spend upwards of $400 on a playset of Jaces...but easily forget that Tarmogoyf was a solid $250+ per playset in it's prime and this was before mythics!

Standard is, and will always be, a money pit. Get used to it. Just don't lay false claims because you don't have the cash flow.

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Originally posted by daner:
When has Standard been fun and "dynamic"?

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quote:

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Originally posted by daner:
Not to pick on you but I've heard this statement WAY to many times since JTMS has been around. Are you all on crack? Seriously? Crack?

Does anyone remember FAE? How about Jund? How about Tarmogoyf? How about Jitte? How about Affinity? Etc etc....When has Standard been fun and "dynamic"?

Are you sure you are not salty because you couldn't afford Jace? It seems so.

Jund was a nightmare! Fae was a nightmare! And don't even start with Affinity.

If anything until all the printing's of stupid equipment making SFM broken this standard was as fun and dynamic a format as there has ever been in a long long time. People only soured on it because they could not afford(or simply didn't want to spend the $) on Jace.

People bitch they had to spend upwards of $400 on a playset of Jaces...but easily forget that Tarmogoyf was a solid $250+ per playset in it's prime and this was before mythics!

Standard is, and will always be, a money pit. Get used to it. Just don't lay false claims because you don't have the cash flow.

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That is pretty presumptive to assume that I don't have the cash flow. In case you didn't see my sale thread before I quite magic I had 4 of virtually everything from the past 7 years. I collected playsets of complete sets. I had all the cards to play legacy, extended, and standard.

Even though money is not a concern for me. What is a concern for me is showing up an FNM and not being able to play because only two or three people show up. The same two or three that can afford $400 for 4 cards. All the other people that play have quite or stopped showing up because they weren't having fun and could not afford the cards.

Nor am I on crack, I just have a different opinion of what is fun. I like playing the game and I accept the standard is a money pit just like limited. Nature of the beast.

Every standard format has had a deck that was simply hated or was perceived as a blight on the format. I understand this but not since the days of Affinity have there been so few alternatives to play with and still be competitive or even just have fun. I can handle losing. I'm Okay with that. But showing up with no hope of even having fun is something that I have no interest in doing.

All of your examples are valid examples of targets that people have picked on for one reason or another. What I mean by "Dynamic" is that when there are 8 or 10 viable decks that can top 16 a GP on any given weekend and still have other arch-types lurking in the shadows waiting to be splashed or busted.

Perhaps there weren't 10 or 12 decks but before Lorwyn rotated there were a number of competitive decks. Fae was a pain but it wasn't so dominating that it beat every other deck hands down. Before ROE there were a number of decks that could take down a tournament on any given weekend. The cards that were printed after this were simply enablers that catapulted Jace 2.0 into a completely different level compared to any of your examples.

So no I'm not on crack. I simply have a different opinion of what I think dynamic is. Dynamic is more than three decks playing rock-paper-scissors. Dynamic is having more than two or three players out of thirty show up for a tournament and having more than two decks played when there is a tournament.

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Originally posted by Volcanon:
You guys are forgetting that Goyf wasn't even played all that much in t2.

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You're joking right? Goyf was everywhere in Standard from August 2007 until rotation.

Good to see other people realize that banning cards doesn't fix the problem with Standard. It just means that whatever will dominant the format for the next 6 months gets an additional three more to mess around.
__________________
Most References in Massachusetts
85th All-time

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Originally posted by Timmyhill:
how will they enforce the part with the event deck.... would it have to check by a judge?

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quote:

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Originally posted by daner:
Not to pick on you but I've heard this statement WAY to many times since JTMS has been around. Are you all on crack? Seriously? Crack?

Does anyone remember FAE? How about Jund? How about Tarmogoyf? How about Jitte? How about Affinity? Etc etc....When has Standard been fun and "dynamic"?

Are you sure you are not salty because you couldn't afford Jace? It seems so.

Jund was a nightmare! Fae was a nightmare! And don't even start with Affinity.

If anything until all the printing's of stupid equipment making SFM broken this standard was as fun and dynamic a format as there has ever been in a long long time. People only soured on it because they could not afford(or simply didn't want to spend the $) on Jace.

People bitch they had to spend upwards of $400 on a playset of Jaces...but easily forget that Tarmogoyf was a solid $250+ per playset in it's prime and this was before mythics!

Standard is, and will always be, a money pit. Get used to it. Just don't lay false claims because you don't have the cash flow.

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Originally posted by Volcanon:
You guys are forgetting that Goyf wasn't even played all that much in t2.

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Originally posted by Bugger:
It's alright, I think daner was just in one of his oh-so-endearing 'ready, fire, aim' moods.

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You know, of all my arguments towards standard I KNEW that my 1-2 sentences about the price of Jace is what people would get defensive about. Glad to see people can read without blinders.

At least sys41o had a valid argument to other points of my post.

It's also funny that a first response is..."I can afford them because I have xDuals/xPower/etc etc.". Wow! Nice ePP! It's so big!

EDIT: Seriously...please point out in my posts were I specifically said "Jace got banned because it was too expensive". I'd love to see you try. Or did you read and think what you wanted to read and think?

I said people bitched about it's price, but made no sense because "x" cards in the past have also been expensive, too. Then listed examples. I never said this was a direct result of it's banning nor should it have been. I'm glad people can Read/Comprehend/Respond.

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Originally posted by JCrak21:
Jace TMS is nowhere near as untouchable as he was in his own block as far as classic and legacy. He's open to everything in classic... Mael Pulse, Vindys, Deeds, Obliv Stones, white removal, every bounce, all the creatures to break thru and get em...

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Originally posted by Myy:
Deeds doesn't.

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Originally posted by daner:
You know, I'm glad you pointed that out. Off topic but is anyone else annoyed (if you happen to own/play with a cube) that awesome mass removal spells do not affect planeswalkers? I find I'm constantly sitting on Deed/Balance and just want to shoot myself when my opponent slaps down a planeswalker.

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__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

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Originally posted by AlmostGrown:
It's a give and take. Deed hits artifact lands the way it is worded now, but the best way to have a mass removal spell that hits planeswalkers too would be "nonland" a la Planar Cleansing

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I forgot about Planar Cleansing. I have Cataclysm as an answer now, but that gets rid of just about everything.

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Originally posted by thror:
Engineer yourself some Explosives.

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