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Author Topic:   Planeswalker Points replacing DCI rating system
caquaa
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posted September 14, 2011 03:07 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for caquaa Click Here to Email caquaa Send a private message to caquaa Click to send caquaa an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View caquaa's Trade Auction or SaleView caquaa's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by yakusoku:
Where did he say he's playing against people who are 100-200 points below him?

to be fair, they likely are.

Some reason and logic is nice to have up in here

I think rats60's biggest problem is associating play skill with rating. Automatically assuming that someone with low rating has no skill is certainly incorrect. When someone with lower rating then me has equal skill does this tell you my rating is too high or possibly theirs is too low? You're making the assumption that mine is too high (which is nice of you) and don't leave room for the other option.

 
WeedIan
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posted September 14, 2011 05:22 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for WeedIan Click Here to Email WeedIan Send a private message to WeedIan Click to send WeedIan an Instant MessageVisit WeedIan's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View WeedIan's Have/Want ListView WeedIan's Have/Want List
The old rating system could be nuts on someone who had a bad streak of luck.

I know a guy who had close to or over a 2000 rating and he just went on a scrub streak and lost nearly 300 points from his rating because he was playing at GPs and PTs.

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rats60
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posted September 14, 2011 07:46 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for rats60 Click Here to Email rats60 Send a private message to rats60 Click to send rats60 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View rats60's Have/Want ListView rats60's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by caquaa:
to be fair, they likely are.

Some reason and logic is nice to have up in here

I think rats60's biggest problem is associating play skill with rating. Automatically assuming that someone with low rating has no skill is certainly incorrect. When someone with lower rating then me has equal skill does this tell you my rating is too high or possibly theirs is too low? You're making the assumption that mine is too high (which is nice of you) and don't leave room for the other option.


I make the assumption based on your rating. I expect a 1900+ rated player to be able to win more than 80% against scrub players. So does ELO. It looks at your rating vs your opponents and says that you should win a certain percentage of the time. If you don't, your rating is too high and theirs is too low and it adjusts for that.

The flaw in the system is that it doesn't punish players for not playing, which it should have. Example, if you didn't play for a month, you lose 10 pts, 2 months another 20 pts ect until you were back to 1600. Take 6 months off and the 1810 player is starting over at 1600. The only way around this is to do what WOTC is, only reward players for playing and winning. You should be happy now because you can rack up lots of easy points playing and beating lesser players.

 
junichi
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posted September 14, 2011 09:18 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for junichi Click Here to Email junichi Send a private message to junichi Click to send junichi an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View junichi's Have/Want ListView junichi's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by rats60:
Garbage.

This is pretty much what you have said so far.

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I3Iood
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posted September 14, 2011 10:15 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for I3Iood Click Here to Email I3Iood Send a private message to I3Iood Click to send I3Iood an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by rats60:
The flaw in the system is that it doesn't punish players for not playing, which it should have. Example, if you didn't play for a month, you lose 10 pts, 2 months another 20 pts ect until you were back to 1600. Take 6 months off and the 1810 player is starting over at 1600. The only way around this is to do what WOTC is, only reward players for playing and winning. You should be happy now because you can rack up lots of easy points playing and beating lesser players.

Factual post: It is a zero-sum system, so this would never work. (ie, all the points in the system sum out to 1600 (taking a 1530 rating as -70 and a 1670 raqting as +70) since when I gain 6 points, my opponent loses 6 points. If you lost points for not playing, the whole system would be out of whack.) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero%E2%80%93sum_game)

My view: Also the idea to punish people for not playing is foolish to me. If I am an 1810 player as you said, just because I have not played for 3 months does not mean I am not still an 1810 player...Where is the logic to punsih players for not playing?

 
SageShadows
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posted September 14, 2011 06:25 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for SageShadows Click Here to Email SageShadows Send a private message to SageShadows Click to send SageShadows an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
In response to ELO, I think someone pointed out that ELO works fine for Chess, where there isn't variance involved. You can just hit the worst matchups and scrub out- it's still not an indication of your playskill. I would have liked some sort of multiplier for the difficulty of the win though; I think that combines the best of both worlds.
 
Thanos
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posted September 14, 2011 07:23 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Thanos Click Here to Email Thanos Send a private message to Thanos Click to send Thanos an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by SageShadows:
In response to ELO, I think someone pointed out that ELO works fine for Chess, where there isn't variance involved. You can just hit the worst matchups and scrub out- it's still not an indication of your playskill. I would have liked some sort of multiplier for the difficulty of the win though; I think that combines the best of both worlds.

What does Electric Light Orchestra have to do with this discussion?

 
yakusoku
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posted September 14, 2011 07:50 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for yakusoku Click Here to Email yakusoku Send a private message to yakusoku Click to send yakusoku an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
ELO rating system.

It's the rating system used for Chess, and previously for Magic.

 
Thanos
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posted September 14, 2011 07:53 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Thanos Click Here to Email Thanos Send a private message to Thanos Click to send Thanos an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by yakusoku:
ELO rating system.

It's the rating system used for Chess, and previously for Magic.


 
Ransam
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posted September 18, 2011 10:45 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Ransam Click Here to Email Ransam Send a private message to Ransam Click to send Ransam an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
There were problems with the old system, but I think they were worth fixing. Its pretty simple to require activity and create a formula that doesn't require a 2xxx rating to beat a 1600 99% of the time or whatever to not lose points.

A lot of people seem to believe the new system punishes inactivity. In reality, it rewards very high volume.

Great players who play a good amount of events and are very active by most standards will no longer have good ratings.

Mediocre players can now beat them just by playing more.

 

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