Author
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Topic: Snapcaster / Delver Banned?
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OCDOD Member
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posted April 01, 2012 08:48 AM
So I've been away from the game for a while. Now that I'm back, I'm seeing Snapcasters and Delver of Secrets in soooo many decks, regardless of format: Block, Standard, Extended, Modern, LegacyBefore I drop $80-100 on a playset of Snapcasters, do you think there is a chance of it getting banned in the future? __________________ - ocdod [at] yahoo [dot] com "UHHHHH. Looks like a rusty ballon knot."
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tragicmagic Member
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posted April 01, 2012 08:50 AM
Not as long as Bloodline Keeper exists.
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AlmostGrown Member
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posted April 01, 2012 09:31 AM
0% chance of either of those cards getting banned.
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B14ckM4g3 Member
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posted April 01, 2012 11:57 AM
Couldn't see it happening. ever. they are both good but not that good. when it comes to a point that EVERY deck in the top 8 are running psuedo-variations od the same deck with the same cards, then maybe. but zombies is amazing in standard, jund is rocking modern, and legacy is, well, legacy with a variation of a multitude of decks, then no.
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Vegas10 Member
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posted April 01, 2012 12:09 PM
never in legacy for sure, would have said never in modern/Standard except with Wild Nacatl a 3 power one drop is considerd to powerful in modern, so it could happen to delver but still unlikley.
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simbayu Member
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posted April 01, 2012 12:12 PM
Not right now. Hes played a lot but the decks hes in aren't dominating the format. They are tier 1 decks but not on the level of caw blade craziness.
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WeedIan Member
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posted April 01, 2012 04:48 PM
quote: Originally posted by Vegas10: never in legacy for sure, would have said never in modern/Standard except with Wild Nacatl a 3 power one drop is considerd to powerful in modern, so it could happen to delver but still unlikley.
They banned Ponder and Preordain instead. __________________ Member Since 03/28/2001 11000+ posts 1st in posts in Ontario 13th in posts on MOTL 5th in Refs in Ontario Pushing to get to top 100 in MOTL Refs
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gcowhsu Member
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posted April 02, 2012 01:16 PM
Sad part they could have fixed the Nacatl/Preordain/Ponder problem by you know unbanning a little card called Mental Misstep.
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coasterdude84 Member
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posted April 02, 2012 01:27 PM
quote: Originally posted by gcowhsu: Sad part they could have fixed the Nacatl/Preordain/Ponder problem by you know unbanning a little card called Mental Misstep.
No clearly Misstep needed to be banned. It can be used to produce infinite mana, can be a potential turn 1 or 2 kill, and can be abused to provide unfair card advantage. Oh wait, no it can't. I know we've been around this block before, but there is nothing broken about Misstep. Having my first turn play countered isn't any worse than when someone plays a FoW, Wastelands me, or removes a threat with a StP or Path. I know your comment was in regards to Modern, but the point is even more valid there. Why does Misstep scare Wizards so much? Regarding Snapcaster, I doubt he'll ever get banned. He just makes graveyard removal more relevant.
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Dolemitesooner Member
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posted April 02, 2012 04:38 PM
Neither should be banned
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Zeckk Member
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posted April 02, 2012 09:54 PM
Too many people forget to look at potential bannings from a design standpoint. Misstep and nacatl were banned because they prevent a lot of deck ideas from ever getting off the ground. Same deal with punishing fire.Snapcaster and delver arguably opened up more meta diversity, which is why they wont get banned. Also, add the fact that players get a full turn before delver can flip. Misstep had the opposite Meta effect than the design team intended, making legacy even more dominated by blue than before, so it was banned as a result.
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angelOFtorment Banned
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posted April 03, 2012 01:12 AM
quote: Originally posted by OCDOD: So I've been away from the game for a while. Now that I'm back, I'm seeing Snapcasters and Delver of Secrets in soooo many decks, regardless of format: Block, Standard, Extended, Modern, LegacyBefore I drop $80-100 on a playset of Snapcasters, do you think there is a chance of it getting banned in the future?
i dont think so,snapcaster and deliever secret will not be banned in standard....sooner or later 1 and half month after AVACYN RESTORED was relaesed and m13 will be came out somewhere in july..if PONDER and PREORDAIN will not be REPRINTED in M13..then snapcaster will not highly valiable as it be or let us say use or even deliever secret will be useful in type 2..
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xxxcryoserumxxx Member
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posted April 05, 2012 09:38 AM
quote: Originally posted by angelOFtorment:
i dont think so,snapcaster and deliever secret will not be banned in standard....sooner or later 1 and half month after AVACYN RESTORED was relaesed and m13 will be came out somewhere in july..if PONDER and PREORDAIN will not be REPRINTED in M13..then snapcaster will not highly valiable as it be or let us say use or even deliever secret will be useful in type 2..
I think snapcaster will be just as played even if ponder and preordain are not reprinted. The reason being bringing back any instant or sorcery at instant speed is just to valuable.
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azazel70820 Member
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posted April 05, 2012 10:03 AM
I would look for Delver to get the axe soon.
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Goaswerfraiejen Member
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posted April 05, 2012 10:14 AM
Definitely not in Legacy. Elsewhere, Iunno.__________________ "I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. EliotRIP Ari Legacy UGB River Rock primer. PM comments/questions. Info on grad school in Phil.
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azazel70820 Member
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posted April 05, 2012 11:56 AM
Thats for Type 2 only.
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BranShan2012 New Member
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posted April 06, 2012 02:27 AM
quote: Originally posted by azazel70820: I would look for Delver to get the axe soon.
If it continues to dominate Standard, then I could see it possible. Let's hope the next set doesn't make the Delver decks any better. quote: Originally posted by Zeckk: Too many people forget to look at potential bannings from a design standpoint. Misstep and nacatl were banned because they prevent a lot of deck ideas from ever getting off the ground. Same deal with punishing fire.Snapcaster and delver arguably opened up more meta diversity, which is why they wont get banned. Also, add the fact that players get a full turn before delver can flip. Misstep had the opposite Meta effect than the design team intended, making legacy even more dominated by blue than before, so it was banned as a result.
I can totally understand misstep getting the axe in Legacy, because blue was becoming too dominate, and an overwhelming number of decks (including some non-blue decks) were running a playset in their 75. However, in modern, blue isn't dominate, and there are a large variety of decks doing well in the format. I think Misstep should at least be considered getting unbanned.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by BranShan2012 on April 06, 2012]
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rockondon Member
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posted April 06, 2012 07:39 AM
I'll cry is snapcaster gets banned. I decided to collect it, I have 10 right now and 15 more coming, and I'm hoping they will still be valuable if/when I ever decide to sell them. __________________ |My Angels~My P9 l""|"\__, |~~My #1 Angel~~l'_|'_|_|) |(@)(@)""***|(@)(@)**|(@)
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coasterdude84 Member
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posted April 06, 2012 09:59 AM
quote: Originally posted by BranShan2012: I can totally understand misstep getting the axe in Legacy, because blue was becoming too dominate, and an overwhelming number of decks (including some non-blue decks) were running a playset in their 75.
Misstep didn't make blue dominant; it was dominant before Misstep was even printed. Jace2.0 is far more problematic. Misstep was a fun and fair counterspell, and what made it awesome was that you could run it in a non-blue deck. In Legacy, the rule has been to ban cards that are simply too good on their own (Strip Mine) or allow you to do broken things very quickly (Hermit Druid). Misstep is neither of those things. It should not be banned simply because "blue is too good right now."
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gcowhsu Member
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posted April 06, 2012 10:07 AM
the whole point of mental misstep was to give other colors a counterspell.
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Speed Demon Banned
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posted April 06, 2012 10:25 AM
quote: Originally posted by gcowhsu: Sad part they could have fixed the Nacatl/Preordain/Ponder problem by you know unbanning a little card called Mental Misstep.
NO. Mental Misstep is a card that should be unprinted IMO. It was a mistake printed the card for the cost that it is. Making a free mana counterspell that counters all 1 drops completely warps the game and it's a mistake that should have never happened. Free counterspells should have some drawback. Having to "sometimes" pay 2 life is not a draw back. Maybe if the card was G/phyrexian-mana then maybe it'd be acceptable but I really even doubt that. I am not sure if Mental Misstep would have been fine if it just costed U.
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coasterdude84 Member
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posted April 06, 2012 12:32 PM
quote: Originally posted by Speed Demon: NO. Mental Misstep is a card that should be unprinted IMO. It was a mistake printed the card for the cost that it is. Making a free mana counterspell that counters all 1 drops completely warps the game and it's a mistake that should have never happened.
How does countering 1-drops warp the game? While there isn't a direct comparison, Spell Snare counters all 2-drops without any problems, Force Spike 99% of the time stops all first turn drops (usually 1-drops), and Chalice of the Void for 2 colorless stops ALL 1-drops. None of these are broken, hell Force Spike doesn't even see play. Only a High Tide or ANT player would think it unfair. quote: Originally posted by Speed Demon: Free counterspells should have some drawback. Having to "sometimes" pay 2 life is not a draw back. Maybe if the card was G/phyrexian-mana then maybe it'd be acceptable but I really even doubt that.
It's only free during the "sometimes" you pay 2 life. Otherwise, you pay a blue. Your argument here doesn't make any sense.
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GenghisTom Member
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posted April 06, 2012 03:48 PM
I Think mental misstep was banned because it contributed to a certain degeneration of the format. Nearly 1/3 of legacy spells cost 1cmc, so it's very relevant and can be run maindeck. The drawback isn't a drawback.And btw, force spike costs mana, chalice hits your own stuff too, and force spike just sucks
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Sovarius Member
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posted April 06, 2012 10:42 PM
quote: Originally posted by coasterdude84: How does countering 1-drops warp the game?
Stop Swords/path, top, vial, lot of goblins and elves, dark ritual. It's only weakness is itself. The other cards you mentioned are too far off for comparison. Those cost mana.
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angelOFtorment Banned
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posted April 07, 2012 03:59 AM
quote: Originally posted by rockondon: I'll cry is snapcaster gets banned. I decided to collect it, I have 10 right now and 15 more coming, and I'm hoping they will still be valuable if/when I ever decide to sell them.
let us hope that WofC will not print some abusive instant and sorceries in the coming set or block to make SNACASTER MAGE COLLECTOR or USER more happier... if WofC will print an abusive instant or sorciery in the coming set or blocked then say goodbye to snacaster mage as same fate what Jace:TMS... lets hope and see that snap will not be axed soon.so far so good let snapcaster mage do his job in some deck like solar flare,U/W control......
[Edited 1 times, lastly by angelOFtorment on April 07, 2012]
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