There's one thing that I need to know, before I can post my suspicions. Liq, did Bernek vote or not?

Thanks,
Jazaray

__________________
A Plastered Dragon Original Limerick:
There was a nice lassie named Jaz
Many wished to have what she has,
A delicate face,
A soft warm embrace,
And a whole lot of bedroom pizzazz.

AGM you say this game needs more posting, you are one of the more active talkers this entire game and yet you don't have anything more to offer then your suspicion of OGB.

If you were so convinced that he was mafia why aren't you trying to push for it like you have with others in this game?

I think this is just another ploy to get people to look at someone who IMO hasn't really seemed suspicious at all this game.

Back to you Jaz, you have been very vocally quiet this game. IMO a little too quiet and staying under the radar. Besides the WCFmo exchange and the little bit of questioning between us.

These are my two suspects and ask others to go back an read what I have to see if anyone else feels the same way I do.

__________________
How many times do I have to have sex with your mom before you realize we have something special.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bernek77:
AGM you say this game needs more posting, you are one of the more active talkers this entire game and yet you don't have anything more to offer then your suspicion of OGB.

If you were so convinced that he was mafia why aren't you trying to push for it like you have with others in this game?

I think this is just another ploy to get people to look at someone who IMO hasn't really seemed suspicious at all this game.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by AlmasterGM:
Because every time I do this people (like you) complain. I made my case on OGB abundantly clear last round. He was nonresponsive to half of it, and the responses he did make were subpar. And now he's silently lurking, hoping he can fly under the radar for the last round, something scum LOVE to do. In any case, nothing regarding OGB has changed between now and last round, and since my opinions are generally not wanted I see no reason to say anything else.

---

I think it's impossible to fly under the radar when half of the people left in the game have mentioned you as one of their top suspects. And why are you so sure this IS the last round? We still have a chance to win this game. Why have you given up? Or are you acting like you already won? Hmm...

Of the people that are left, the only two not to vote for WCFmo, who was obvmafia, are AGM and thror. I'm pretty sure that one, if not both, of these two are mafia.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jazaray:
Liq, did Bernek vote or not?

Thanks,
Jazaray

---

I did not receive a vote from Bernek.

Whether this be from a Mailbox hiccup or simple forgetfulness, I know not.

__________________
There's no need to fear, UNDERDOG is here!

All your Gruul Nodorogs are belong to me. Trade them to me, please!

Report rules violations.

quote:

---

Originally posted by nderdog:
We're in trouble, guys. Votes are due today, and we're splitting votes between AGM and OGB, with side orders of Jaz and Bernek each seeming to want to vote for each other. We need to come together and nail a Mafia or it's lights out. The worst possible thing we can do is spread votes everywhere or the Mafia will pile on for an easy victory. We need a lot of talking and we need a consensus.

---

Nder I have made my stance an believe AGM to be mafia. I also suspect Jaz to possibly be the other one at this point. Of all the remaining players these 2 stick out the most IMO.

I have to agree with OGB last statement and I feel as though AGM is celebrating a bit prematurely. If other people really believe OGB to be mafia, please show me a list of posts that say he is mafia. I think if we lynch OGB we lose!!!!!!

submitted my vote for AGM

__________________
How many times do I have to have sex with your mom before you realize we have something special.

quote:

---

Originally posted by OGB:
I think it's impossible to fly under the radar when half of the people left in the game have mentioned you as one of their top suspects.

---

Well, you just did it. Votes are due tonight and this is the first we are hearing from you. You still haven't responded to anything I said yesterday and are relying entirely on everyone's preconceived dislike towards me to get me lynched this round.

quote:

---

And why are you so sure this IS the last round? We still have a chance to win this game. Why have you given up? Or are you acting like you already won? Hmm...

---

First, stop twisting my words - if we don't lynch mafia this IS the last round, so I don't see what's so bad about that. Second, since a lot of people want to vote for me, if I were mafia, why would I be celebrating early? I might die. Third, even if all that is true, it'

quote:

---

Of the people that are left, the only two not to vote for WCFmo, who was obvmafia, are AGM and thror. I'm pretty sure that one, if not both, of these two are mafia.

---

What? If the mafia weren't going to bus WCFmo, why would they have had him engage in that huge spectacle of voting MW/etc? The whole (presumable, unless WCFmo legitimately snapped, which I doubt) point of that was so the mafia could easily get on the wagon and not be found.

Either way, it's WIFOM.

quote:

---

I have to agree with OGB last statement and I feel as though AGM is celebrating a bit prematurely. If other people really believe OGB to be mafia, please show me a list of posts that say he is mafia. I think if we lynch OGB we lose!!!!!!

---

What posts have OGB made this game for us to really suspect him over you?

__________________
How many times do I have to have sex with your mom before you realize we have something special.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bernek77:
Nder I have made my stance an believe AGM to be mafia. I also suspect Jaz to possibly be the other one at this point. Of all the remaining players these 2 stick out the most IMO.

I have to agree with OGB last statement and I feel as though AGM is celebrating a bit prematurely. If other people really believe OGB to be mafia, please show me a list of posts that say he is mafia. I think if we lynch OGB we lose!!!!!!

submitted my vote for AGM

---

Correct Bernek - if I'm lynched, the game will be over. I also now don't think Bernek is mafia because he would have just bandwagonned with nder and AGM to kill me and win the game.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bernek77:
AGM so you think OGB is flying under the radar? Who else do you suspect as the last mafia? As you asked b4 for people to list their two suspects, who would it take for us to win if you are not mafia?

---

Yes, I believe OGB is flying under the radar. Look at his posts - they come late and do nothing except feed you propaganda against me - propaganda that has no concrete evidence to back it up and is based entirely on appeals to emotion.

As far as who the last mafia is, it strongly depends on how the votes play down this round. It also depends on what posts people make in the next 24 hours. Put simply, the only person I don't consider to be a suspect right now is nder,who is playing very pro-town right now.

quote:

---

What posts have OGB made this game for us to really suspect him over you?

---

For starters, the one I quote just below this paragraph. In general, however, it's not so much any specific post as much as a general trend of lurking and bad arguments. If you read his contributions over time, especially in the last two rounds, he doesn't do anything - he lurks, posts information instead of analysis, and other fluff. When he does make arguments, they are not good. He avoids confrontation and relies on AtE and other logical fallacies to prove his point.

As for why you prefer him over me, you prefer him because there isn't actually a case on me at all. OGB dropped the case on me LAST ROUND and hasn't picked it back up. He is relying on you to forget that fact. He keeps playing on your emotions to try and make you vote for me. Look at his post below, where he buddies up and stokes your ingrained, unwarranted distrust of me. His entire case on me is built upon a non-existant premise. Cut through the crap. OGB is just trying to distract you from his own scumminess long enough so he can win the game.

If you actually want me to go back and quote all of OGB's posts for you so you can see the patterns I'm talking about, I can do that, but it'd be a lot of work so it'd be much easier if you just go look yourself. Trust me, you'll see the trends.

tl;dr - Don't take mafia's bait. Disappoint OGB starting immediately by rejecting his buddying and calling him out on his unjustified case, blatant AtE's, and lurking playstyle.

quote:

---

Originally posted by OGB:
Correct Bernek - if I'm lynched, the game will be over. I also now don't think Bernek is mafia because he would have just bandwagonned with nder and AGM to kill me and win the game.

---

AGM has blown a lot of smoke this game. But now, in what could be the last round, he falls almost silent? Trying not to get killed AGM?

Jaz has been silent most of the game. Her recent post says she was sick, and it being Jaz i'll give her that one. I can't get much more on Jaz because she isn't a big poster.

I don't know if my vision on OGB is clouded by outside influence or not, so for this round I'm honestly going to drop it. I'd rather spend my effort re-evaluating AGM again.

quote:

---

Originally posted by thror:
AGM has blown a lot of smoke this game. But now, in what could be the last round, he falls almost silent? Trying not to get killed AGM?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by AlmasterGM:
Nice buddying attempt. Keep on feeding the Bernek illusions, OGB - he's not the only vote you need to win over, and everyone else sees exactly what you're doing.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by OGB:
How am I buddying up here? Because Bernek thinks I'm a cit and I'm confirming that fact? Or because I crossed him off my list of suspects? How is this any different than you saying the only person you're not suspicious of is nderdog?

---

Bernek's already declared for AGM. Thror seems to be leaning toward AGM over OGB as well.

The way I see it, there are 4 possiblilities the way things are lining up. Obviously this is subject to change if a different 2 people become the leading suspects, but just change the names as appropriate and it all works out the same.

1) (worst-case-scenario) A Cit votes for someone other than OGB or AGM.

In this case, the Mafia piles on any of the 3 who are not Mafia, game over, we lose.

All below scenarios assume we block-vote for one of the 2 leading suspects:

2) Neither OGB or AGM are Mafia.

It doesn't matter which we pile on this round, the game is over, we lose.

3) Both OGB and AGM are Mafia

It doesn't matter which we pile on this round, the game continues.

4) Either OGB OR AGM is Mafia but not both.

If the Cits split their votes evenly, the Mafia piles on the Cit, game over, we lose.

If we all pile on to one, it's a coin-flip whether we made the right choice or not. A coin-flip still beats the sure loss if we split our votes.

Given this, as things stand, I'm willing to change my vote from OGB to AGM in order to ensure a block-vote which gives us the best possible chance to avoid a game-losing mis-lynch. If anyone wants us to go a different direction, we need to decide it immediately, as we're running out of time very quickly.

__________________
There's no need to fear, UNDERDOG is here!

All your Gruul Nodorogs are belong to me. Trade them to me, please!

Report rules violations.

quote:

---

Originally posted by AlmasterGM:
You post has the sole intent of making Bernek like you more. Saying "Yes, Bernek, I'm a cit" has no warrant and thus no other effect. It is different from nder and I because nder suspects me. Also, nder is actually acting pro-town.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by OGB:
Why would I need to buddy up to someone who doesn't suspect me. It's counterproductive. On the other hand, you're buddying up with someone who suspects you. You have lots more incentive to do this, trying to save your own hide.

---

Nder isn't going to fall for buddying, if what I was doing was even buddying. Bernek is a wild-card and you need to ensure he does not stray. You have every reason to buddy. You have not responded to my argument that your post has no purpose EXCEPT to buddy.

quote:

---

Originally posted by nder:
Logic.

---

This makes perfect sense ... except I am a citizen, so we are going to lose. Thus, I am forced to propose the illogical plan of: I vote for OGB, you vote for OGB, and hope two out of Jaz, thror, or Bernek votes OGB. This is the only possible chance we have at survival.

OBG - AGM
Bernek - AGM
AGM - OGB
nderdog - ? (OGB or AGM)
thror - ? (OGB or AGM)
Jaz - ?

(We are assuming nder's Scenario #4 - either OGB or AGM is mafia, not both - obviously I'm assuming AGM is mafia in this scenario. This also assumes that Jaz is mafia and votes last. If she was a cit, she'd obviously be part of the block vote.)

If thror and nder vote AGM, then he's lynched and we have a 50/50 shot of him being mafia.

If thror and nder split their votes, Jaz votes for OGB and it's a coin flip as to who gets lynched, so 25% shot of hitting mafia.

quote:

---

Originally posted by AlmasterGM:
Nder isn't going to fall for buddying, if what I was doing was even buddying. Bernek is a wild-card and you need to ensure he does not stray. You have every reason to buddy. You have not responded to my argument that your post has no purpose EXCEPT to buddy.

---

Bernek already stated that he thought I was a cit before the "buddy" post. If he already thinks that, then why would I need to keep after it?

quote:

---

Originally posted by OGB:
Here are the votes so far:

OBG - AGM
Bernek - AGM
AGM - OGB
nderdog - ? (OGB or AGM)
thror - ? (OGB or AGM)
Jaz - ?

(We are assuming nder's Scenario #4 - either OGB or AGM is mafia, not both - obviously I'm assuming AGM is mafia in this scenario. This also assumes that Jaz is mafia and votes last. If she was a cit, she'd obviously be part of the block vote.)

If thror and nder vote AGM, then he's lynched and we have a 50/50 shot of him being mafia. This makes no sense because I just said we presume AGM is mafia, which means there should be a 100% chance of me being mafia.

If thror and nder split their votes, Jaz votes for OGB and it's a coin flip as to who gets lynched, so 25% shot of hitting mafia. This also makes no sense because there are two candidates here and I'm presuming one is mafia, one is town, meaning there should be a 50% chance.

If thror and nder both vote for OGB, then Jaz piles on to the OGB vote, and the cits win.

---

Fixed.

quote:

---

Originally posted by AlmasterGM:
This makes perfect sense ... except I am a citizen, so we are going to lose. Thus, I am forced to propose the illogical plan of: I vote for OGB, you vote for OGB, and hope two out of Jaz, thror, or Bernek votes OGB. This is the only possible chance we have at survival.

---

You'll have to forgive me for not taking your word on this one. Without making an assumption that we can't afford to make that you're a Cit, your logic only leads to a greater chance of failure for us. I've pointed out why a split vote will likely hand the Mafia the win here. If you can convince all of us that OGB is more likely to be Mafia than you, then you'll live. Encouraging me to do something that is anti-town isn't the best way to start.

quote:

---

Originally posted by OGB:
(We are assuming nder's Scenario #4 - either OGB or AGM is mafia, not both - obviously I'm assuming AGM is mafia in this scenario. This also assumes that Jaz is mafia and votes last. If she was a cit, she'd obviously be part of the block vote.)

---

Again, this is assuming a lot that I just don't think that it's a good idea for the rest of us to do.

At this point I really could go either way, but it's an absolute must that we all work together, so we need some non-AGM/OGB people to start speaking up a lot more here.

__________________
There's no need to fear, UNDERDOG is here!

All your Gruul Nodorogs are belong to me. Trade them to me, please!

Report rules violations.

Get them in.

Right now, I think that Bernek and AGM are the final mafia. I think that the two of them going after each other practically this whole game is to try and ensure that, when we lynch one and he's mafia, the other can come out saying "Hey, I've been FOR lynching him the WHOLE GAME!" I WOULD find it exceedingly suspicious if Berenk didn't vote after all, because, at the time, the votes were going 3 v 3 (if Bern had voted) for Monty vs AGM. And, because I didn't declare, he "forgot" to vote, or it "got lost in the PM system". But, as we can't really prove it WASN'T the PM system that went screwy..

Bern has been acting suspiciously the whole game, IMHO, and I've had to ask myself, out of who that's left would make the most sense to be his partner, and AGM just makes the most sense to me, this is why:

I think it's BERN that's doing the "buddying up" to OGB, after all, he's the one who said OGB wasn't mafia, first, not the other way around. Trying to get OGB on his side maybe?

I think that AGM is right, nder is acting pro town, so he's off my list.

Thror: I can't quite place him, really.. I guess he *could* be mafia, but I just don't think he is.

That leaves me with AGM being Bern's partner. But, I'm not entirely sure on AGM. I'm more sure about Bern and I'd really rather vote for him.

However, if I do so, I saw the stats, it's NOT going to turn out as a cit win if I don't vote for either OGB or AGM.

So, I guess I'm stuck with voting for AGM, as he's my second suspect.

Thanks,
Jazaray

__________________
A Plastered Dragon Original Limerick:
There was a nice lassie named Jaz
Many wished to have what she has,
A delicate face,
A soft warm embrace,
And a whole lot of bedroom pizzazz.

We need to declare or this all goes to heck, so my vote is AGM.