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Author
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Topic: Jace 3.0 discussion: Good, really good, or broken?
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Devonin
Member
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posted June 29, 2011 06:52 AM
        
I imagine the benefit is that they're trying (again) to make mill into a valid deck strategy. You're not just milling 10 or 20 (maybe 30!) you're using all of the other sources of milling that they seem to be printing. It hasn't really been good yet, we'll see if they can make mill good this time around.Also, everything everyone seems to be saying about Innistrad is that it's going to be very Graveyard heavy mechanically, so you might end up wanting to mill yourself.
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Jtrade77
Member
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posted June 30, 2011 12:39 PM
Even Chapin's article on starcity (premium) side that tried to hype the card, failed. The deck Chapin put together to 'showcase' Jace 3.0 only used one copy and could be played without him. It didn't impress me.To me, this is saying "Very cheap card after hype goes away." Maybe equating it to Liliana Vess was too generous. This version of Jace is at the same level as Nissa Revane or Chandra Ablaze. Innistrad may change this, but I doubt it. A five mana enabler is too costly; the 'Traumatize Yourself' strategy never worked with reanimation.
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VividDeathPanda
Member
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posted June 30, 2011 03:08 PM
He has potential, a lot of people are going to go "OMG NEW JACE!!!! I CAN HAZ DECK????" and build a ridiculously sucky mil deck driving the price up when he releases. They will get their butts kicked and then get mad thinking he is a stupid card and his price will fall. Then all the good players will be like "Hmm Jace 3.0..." build good decks and then Innistrad will release making him jump slightly. Playability wise, he is cool and has potential in mono-blue control/mil decks and grave eater decks. The idea of his ultimate+Jace's archivist makes me laugh a demented laugh. I hope to pull a few just to have and maybe for EDH.
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Shadows
Member
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posted July 09, 2011 02:55 PM
quote:
Originally posted by ninjazwig:
The dude is a limited bomb and that's about all I see for now.
Out of my 6 packs (at the pre-release), I pulled 3, including a foil one (my other packs were Primeval/Sun Titan, and Visions of Beyond). Case in point, I went undefeated (ran green/blue aggromill (?). Posting because... right after the tournament, I sold the 2 non foil copies @ 55 each, and the foil one @ 120. Take advantage of it now... HURRY UP! (P.S. I ordered my set @ 15 each... just in case it somehow becomes jace 2.0.. just sayin).
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Bugger
Member
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posted July 09, 2011 03:27 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Shadows:
Out of my 6 packs (at the pre-release), I pulled 3, including a foil one (my other packs were Primeval/Sun Titan, and Visions of Beyond). Case in point, I went undefeated (ran green/blue aggromill (?).Posting because... right after the tournament, I sold the 2 non foil copies @ 55 each, and the foil one @ 120. Take advantage of it now... HURRY UP! (P.S. I ordered my set @ 15 each... just in case it somehow becomes jace 2.0.. just sayin).
Jace Memory Adept will never ever clear 50$ a pop during its time in standard (barring any initial price skew from presales), and you can quote me on that. He is not another mind sculptor in pretty much every measurable way. He costs 5 mana, he does not protect himself, and his ultimate does not win the game. He will not dominate lists. __________________
"I never got any respect at all. My family moved a lot when I was a kid, but I always found them."
-- Rodney Dangerfield
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Shadows
Member
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posted July 09, 2011 04:04 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Bugger:
Jace Memory Adept will never ever clear 50$ a pop during its time in standard (barring any initial price skew from presales), and you can quote me on that. He is not another mind sculptor in pretty much every measurable way. He costs 5 mana, he does not protect himself, and his ultimate does not win the game. He will not dominate lists.
Hence why I said take advantage now. Also, I only bought mine due to the cheapness. Unfortunately no one can predict the future, so I'm gunna hang onto them until its officially considered a pos. Worse case scenario, they're trade bait for ppl that want mill to be viable. I agree with you.. but like I said, no one can predict the future.
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Harmless
Member
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posted July 09, 2011 06:38 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Bugger:
Jace Memory Adept will never ever clear 50$ a pop during its time in standard (barring any initial price skew from presales), and you can quote me on that. He is not another mind sculptor in pretty much every measurable way. He costs 5 mana, he does not protect himself, and his ultimate does not win the game. He will not dominate lists.
He was trolling... 6 packs, 5 mythics, 3 of the chase mythic, including one foil, sold them for more than they've ever been worth, bought for half of what they've ever been worth?
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WeedIan
Member
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posted July 09, 2011 08:10 PM
Jace 3 is just bad.Want Jace Beleren. __________________
Member Since 03/28/2001
10000+ posts
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Thanos
Member
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posted July 09, 2011 08:31 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Harmless:
He was trolling...6 packs, 5 mythics, 3 of the chase mythic, including one foil, sold them for more than they've ever been worth, bought for half of what they've ever been worth?
My thoughts exactly.
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Shadows
Member
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posted July 09, 2011 09:17 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Harmless:
He was trolling...6 packs, 5 mythics, 3 of the chase mythic, including one foil, sold them for more than they've ever been worth, bought for half of what they've ever been worth?
Except not. Fortunately, I have better things to do with my time than troll people. Also, of course I'm going to sell them for more than they're worth...? Set was just released, POS card has a ton of hype. And since I was the only one at my store that had copies of them, I was pretty much able to ask whatever. The point of what I said, was while I agree that it's a pretty bad card, there's going to be a ton of people willing to pay X amount of money to get a playset.. at least for a while. Be it because it's a "Jace" and they think it'll be another Jace 2.0, or because they want to run mill. Honestly, I don't care too much if you believe me or not, just simply explaining my experience with it so far. Also, in terms of getting chase mythics out of boxes, I've personally sat next to people that have pulled playsets of Koth, BSA (not really "chase" anymore I guess), Tezzeret, ect. That's all I had to add... enjoy your jace banter : ).
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ScottyStyles
Member
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posted July 10, 2011 12:21 AM
Pulled one in 2hg; built both decks around a Jace-centric theme (Jace deck had tons of draw/filter to find it, and other mill to get there so Jace only had to act like a Glimpse. Other deck supported and defended Jace.) Went undefeated off the back of the one card.In constructed, I think it won't drop as low as you guys are claiming. It's better than Glimpse, IMO, which is *still* at $10 despite being 100% for casual only at this point. Besides, having an orange symbol instantly jacks up the price in many people's eyes. I would wager it will never drop below a $20 price tag.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by ScottyStyles on July 10, 2011]
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rats60
Member
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posted July 10, 2011 08:56 AM
quote:
Originally posted by ScottyStyles:
I would wager it will never drop below a $20 price tag.
I'd take that bet in a millisecond. Koth is under 20 and he's actually playable. I'd go a step further. With him being in the core set, I expect him to be reprinted at least once (in M13) if not more than that. I see him being less than 10.00 in the future. Jace Beleren is a better card and it's under 10.00. Even former 40.00 Elspeth, Knight-Errant is getting close to 10.00. There is no way that Jace 3.0 holds 20.00.
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Devonin
Member
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posted July 10, 2011 09:29 AM
quote:
Originally posted by rats60:
I'd take that bet in a millisecond. Koth is under 20 and he's actually playable. I'd go a step further. With him being in the core set, I expect him to be reprinted at least once (in M13) if not more than that. I see him being less than 10.00 in the future. Jace Beleren is a better card and it's under 10.00. Even former 40.00 Elspeth, Knight-Errant is getting close to 10.00. There is no way that Jace 3.0 holds 20.00.
Outside Standard, the only things you can use him for are done WAY more efficiently by other things. I'd expect 10/12 to be the holding point.
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ScottyStyles
Member
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posted July 10, 2011 08:16 PM
True, I didn't account for Jace being reprinted in M13, etc. But all the cards you listed do very 'normal' Magic things. Make dorks, gain life, deal damage. Jace does mill, which very few cards out there do, and which will always hold a special place for casual players. Look at Glimpse the Unthinkable, and consider that this Jace is essentially a Glimpse on crack for the casual player it will widely appeal to. That's where I'm basing my assumptions on. If he gets reprinted though, he'll plummet longterm, I absolutely agree.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by ScottyStyles on July 10, 2011]
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daner
Member
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posted July 10, 2011 09:10 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Shadows:
Except not. Fortunately, I have better things to do with my time than troll people. Also, of course I'm going to sell them for more than they're worth...? Set was just released, POS card has a ton of hype. And since I was the only one at my store that had copies of them, I was pretty much able to ask whatever. The point of what I said, was while I agree that it's a pretty bad card, there's going to be a ton of people willing to pay X amount of money to get a playset.. at least for a while. Be it because it's a "Jace" and they think it'll be another Jace 2.0, or because they want to run mill. Honestly, I don't care too much if you believe me or not, just simply explaining my experience with it so far. Also, in terms of getting chase mythics out of boxes, I've personally sat next to people that have pulled playsets of Koth, BSA (not really "chase" anymore I guess), Tezzeret, ect. That's all I had to add... enjoy your jace banter : ).
You did not open 5 mythics in 6 packs...2 of which were the same mythic. Then open 2 other chase mythics and chase rare. You are lying. Stop lying. Obviously you don't have better things to do with your time, because your time is consumed by lying. You did not sell these for $50+ each....they are not even that much on SCG. How on earth did liar like you hustle someone for more than SCGs? Oh right, you're a liar. No, tons of people wont get in line to buy a bad jace just because it's a jace. No, you haven't sat next to people who have pulled an entire playset of chase mythics from a single box...you probably haven't even sat next to people. It's obvious you care, otherwise you wouldn't have posted. Nobody likes a bragger...which is what you are also trying to accomplish. Next time you brag though, at least make it reasonable. Don't be such a liar. I too could walk around all day telling people I slept with Anne Hathaway, but lying within reason like I slept with your mom is a lot more believeable. Next time you lie....start small 
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ScottyStyles
Member
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posted July 10, 2011 11:37 PM
quote:
Originally posted by daner:
I slept with Anne Hathaway
That's all I got from your post.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by ScottyStyles on July 10, 2011]
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oneofchaos
Member
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posted July 11, 2011 12:28 AM
quote:
Originally posted by ScottyStyles:
That's all I got from your post.
Shadow did that and then Anne Hathaway pulled a charizard out of a M12 booster. Top that!
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CubFan81
Member
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posted July 11, 2011 06:17 AM
quote:
Originally posted by oneofchaos:
Shadow did that and then Anne Hathaway pulled a charizard out of a M12 booster. Top that!
I call BS. Charizard would easily be Mythic and he already listed his mythics.
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rats60
Member
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posted July 11, 2011 08:43 AM
quote:
Originally posted by daner:
No, you haven't sat next to people who have pulled an entire playset of chase mythics from a single box...you probably haven't even sat next to people.
I've seen 3 Tezzerets out of a box once. I've seen 2 reg BS Colossus + 1 foil out of a box once. I pulled 2 Tezzerets out of back to back packs once. This is out of several hundred boxes I've opened/seen opened. He should have just said he pulled 3 Jaces, that would have been possible, but 5 good mythics out of 6 packs plus a good rare? We all know that didn't happen.
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rats60
Member
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posted July 11, 2011 08:50 AM
quote:
Originally posted by ScottyStyles:
True, I didn't account for Jace being reprinted in M13, etc. But all the cards you listed do very 'normal' Magic things. Make dorks, gain life, deal damage. Jace does mill, which very few cards out there do, and which will always hold a special place for casual players. Look at Glimpse the Unthinkable, and consider that this Jace is essentially a Glimpse on crack for the casual player it will widely appeal to. That's where I'm basing my assumptions on. If he gets reprinted though, he'll plummet longterm, I absolutely agree.
Glimpse costs 2 to play. Traumatize does a better job, it costs less to play and it's a dollar card. Jace Beleren mills too and those aren't even the good mill cards. Brain Freeze and Grindstone are the mill cards people want. I'm sure that Jace 3.0 is going to be wanted by casual players, but that doesn't mean that it is going to be worth more than every planeswalker not named Jace TMS.
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oneofchaos
Member
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posted July 11, 2011 09:20 AM
quote:
Originally posted by CubFan81:
I call BS. Charizard would easily be Mythic and he already listed his mythics.
Fine. He forgot to list his super mythic. It's super rare and will have literally no impact on standard. Here is a preview Not_a_broken_card
Mana cost U
Instant
Draw 3..make that 2 cards
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Bugger
Member
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posted July 11, 2011 09:40 AM
quote:
Originally posted by ScottyStyles:
That's all I got from your post.
WHAT?! You mean Anne is cheating on me?  __________________
"I never got any respect at all. My family moved a lot when I was a kid, but I always found them."
-- Rodney Dangerfield
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oneofchaos
Member
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posted July 11, 2011 09:42 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Bugger:
WHAT?! You mean Anne is cheating on me?
Did you think she'd seriously commit to just one man?
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gcowhsu
Member
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posted July 11, 2011 10:14 AM
The only reason Jace Beleren has value is because he stops the real Jace. This guy doesn't stop mindsculpter. They still get to do one ability before this guy kills mindsculpter. Jace beleren comes out a turn before rendering Mindsculpter useless until it leaves the board.
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daner
Member
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posted July 11, 2011 10:22 AM
quote:
Originally posted by ScottyStyles:
That's all I got from your post.
I typed that post and all I can remember is the "I slept with Anne Hathaway" part myself.... quote:
Originally posted by Bugger:
WHAT?! You mean Anne is cheating on me?
How much do you hate Jake Gyllenhall(sp)? I mean seriously...luckiest/worst actor ever? Well I'll give him Donnie Darko, but then again even Matthew Mcconaughey has Dazed and Confused to fall back on from time to time.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by daner on July 11, 2011]
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