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Author	Topic: Modern masters 2015... Huge failure
Lemonjuice Member	posted May 27, 2015 09:56 AM How can any of you ignore the most important missing factor here? New card smell is gone.
wayne Member	posted May 27, 2015 11:50 AM quote: Originally posted by coolio: premium set? the point of the set was to bank dollars.. from everyone who clamored for at least 1 pt a yr for the most despised format of the pros.. quote: Originally posted by daner: If this is what we get to look forward too the I predict the death of Modern sooner rather than later. I already can't stand to play the damn format as is....but that's just my personal opinion. I cannot stand modern also, but you both are overlooking the other side of the coin. The nature of the Modern format allows lots of non-pro players to win or top 8 small (i.e. 5-6 swiss rounds) tournaments which creates a decent following that is good for business.
iccarus Member	posted May 27, 2015 12:36 PM I like the concept of modern. It's great to have a format with more depth than standard that allows for a broad card pool to be used. The fact that nothing is on the reserved list should, in theory, make it easier to reprint cards and allow the key pieces of the format to be more accessible to the player base. The problem is that WotC/Hasbro has not taken advantage of the one benefit Modern should have over access to Legacy. Namely, the fact that no building block of the format is on the reserved list. They cater far too much to collectors by trying to preserve the value of cards and make little half-steps towards getting enough new cards on the market. Even with three printings, the fact that goyf is still at $500+ for a playset is just simply ridiculous. __________________ Wisconsin - smells like dairy air! I collect Granite Gargoyles. Send them my way.
Volcanon Member	posted May 27, 2015 01:52 PM quote: Originally posted by iccarus: I like the concept of modern. It's great to have a format with more depth than standard that allows for a broad card pool to be used. The fact that nothing is on the reserved list should, in theory, make it easier to reprint cards and allow the key pieces of the format to be more accessible to the player base. The problem is that WotC/Hasbro has not taken advantage of the one benefit Modern should have over access to Legacy. Namely, the fact that no building block of the format is on the reserved list. They cater far too much to collectors by trying to preserve the value of cards and make little half-steps towards getting enough new cards on the market. Even with three printings, the fact that goyf is still at $500+ for a playset is just simply ridiculous. It would be bad if they simply reprinted Tarmogoyf as a common like they do with Yugioh. It would also be a bad precedent. Means they could reprint all of the shocklands as common or whatever.
coasterdude84 Member	posted May 27, 2015 02:31 PM quote: Originally posted by iccarus: They cater far too much to collectors by trying to preserve the value of cards and make little half-steps towards getting enough new cards on the market. Even with three printings, the fact that goyf is still at $500+ for a playset is just simply ridiculous. That's not catering to collectors; that's catering to the player base that has already invested a good chunk of change into their cards. If they reprinted goyf at common and it drops to $3, I'm not about to shell out $20 for [insert card name here] because they'll probably reprint it ad nauseum. When that happens, everyday packs aren't worth $3, resulting in unsold product. Wizards has to walk a fine line here. Cards need to be available and not get crazy expensive, otherwise it will drive players away, but going Chronicles on the format will do the same thing.
psyduck_dude12 Member	posted May 27, 2015 02:53 PM quote: Originally posted by coasterdude84: That's not catering to collectors; that's catering to the player base that has already invested a good chunk of change into their cards. If they reprinted goyf at common and it drops to $3, I'm not about to shell out $20 for [insert card name here] because they'll probably reprint it ad nauseum. When that happens, everyday packs aren't worth $3, resulting in unsold product. Wizards has to walk a fine line here. Cards need to be available and not get crazy expensive, otherwise it will drive players away, but going Chronicles on the format will do the same thing. this, whoever played during the chronicles era knows this. I play magic because I enjoy the game and the fact it still has some value, Yugioh on the other hand, not quite. [Edited 1 times, lastly by psyduck_dude12 on May 27, 2015]
Pail42 Member	posted May 27, 2015 04:02 PM Wizards admits to "printing and collation issues" but doesn't actually say they'll replace damaged or incorrect product (unless you're at a GP - then they'll fix it on site). http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/modern-masters-2015-edition-booster-packs-2015-05-26
iccarus Member	posted May 27, 2015 05:52 PM I am by no means suggesting that goyf should be printed at common or reprinting in a manner that completely tanks the value. My point was there has to be a better balance than where we are right now. I don't know how to get there, but they're currently not doing much more than drip-feeding a new supply onto the market that's clearly not keeping up with demand. I have a hard time seeing how Modern can really grow as a viable tournament option when you have a pillar of the format going for over $100. __________________ Wisconsin - smells like dairy air! I collect Granite Gargoyles. Send them my way.
mtglover Member	posted May 27, 2015 07:32 PM quote: Originally posted by iccarus: I am by no means suggesting that goyf should be printed at common or reprinting in a manner that completely tanks the value. My point was there has to be a better balance than where we are right now. I don't know how to get there, but they're currently not doing much more than drip-feeding a new supply onto the market that's clearly not keeping up with demand. I have a hard time seeing how Modern can really grow as a viable tournament option when you have a pillar of the format going for over $100. Goyf is currently more than 2x times the value of the next highest value card. I suspect it is more due to collectors than players. So there really isn't a middle ground here. Print too little, it'll stay high. Print too much, collector's will sell them off and ruin its value. At least that is what I think.
paragondave Member	posted May 27, 2015 09:05 PM Apparently all the good cards are in the 4th box you open. First 2 packs...Goyf, then Mox Opal. Boom. 3rd pack had Noble Hierarch. so, the 4th box had these notables... Tarmogoyf Mox Opal Noble Hierarch Cryptic Command Karn Liberated Wilt-Leaf Liege Vendilion Clique Blinkmoth Nexus Leyline of Sanctity They could have spread some of those out in the other 3 boxes. :/ [Edited 2 times, lastly by paragondave on May 27, 2015]
LandDestroyer Member	posted May 28, 2015 07:28 AM quote: Originally posted by paragondave: Apparently all the good cards are in the 4th box you open. First 2 packs...Goyf, then Mox Opal. Boom. 3rd pack had Noble Hierarch. so, the 4th box had these notables... Tarmogoyf Mox Opal Noble Hierarch Cryptic Command Karn Liberated Wilt-Leaf Liege Vendilion Clique Blinkmoth Nexus Leyline of Sanctity They could have spread some of those out in the other 3 boxes. :/ Thanks, Dave. I have 4 boxes coming today. I'm just going to open the last one now Opened the 4th box of mma in the shipping box. wasn't too good retail value about breaks even if i count every card 1 cryptic 1 bitter 1 kozilek 1 iona 1 leyline 1 all is dust 1 blinkmoth 2 cheap foil rares damaged with a line on them (lodestone/necroskitter) 1 foil remand 1 electroylyze, smash to s, mutagenic growth, gut shot. rest of the box is crap i mean, it's definitely better than a few boxes ive heard about but not good Edit: OMG. I opened a 2nd box of the 4 I got in. in 1 box i got a foil goyf (very last pack) a foil clique, 1 elesh, 1 kozilek, 2 wilt leaf, 1 NH, 1 twin, 1 foil endrek and small stuff like foil spec proc and a hurk recall. so glad i opened 2nd box. [Edited 4 times, lastly by LandDestroyer on May 28, 2015]
Tim05 Member	posted May 28, 2015 01:58 PM quote: Originally posted by LandDestroyer: Edit: OMG. I opened a 2nd box of the 4 I got in. in 1 box i got a foil goyf (very last pack) a foil clique, 1 elesh, 1 kozilek, 2 wilt leaf, 1 NH, 1 twin, 1 foil endrek and small stuff like foil spec proc and a hurk recall. so glad i opened 2nd box. Wow. Very jealous. Foil Goyf and foil clique in same box...Congrats dude! [Edited 1 times, lastly by Tim05 on May 28, 2015]
LandDestroyer Member	posted May 28, 2015 02:05 PM quote: Originally posted by Tim05: Wow. Very jealous. Foil Goyf and foil clique in same box...Congrats dude! thanks man. i recorded both boxes. trying to upload to youtube but they are like 15-20 minute videos. the 1st one is uploaded but when i play nothing is showing up. dunno if it lags or what. will link in if they work and if you guys don't give me too hard a time about being a 32 year old who sounds like he is 18 ish :-p i got excited and rats shouldn't watch the videos. i spend the first half kinda bitching about things lol uploaded but they haven't been converted yet so you might not be able to view yet meh box https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9XriaaabUA amazeballs box https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xf-dVqCXUw foil clique at like 8:30 minutes in and goyf is in the last pack [Edited 2 times, lastly by LandDestroyer on May 28, 2015]
psyduck_dude12 Member	posted May 28, 2015 03:23 PM I'm actually happy with the boxes I got, cryptic and noble help prop the price up. Nothing crazy and I've only opened two so far but I think I'll stop there (all cards are 5$+): Box 1 (paid 240+tax locally to support my lgs) Tarmogoyf Elesh Norn Karn noble hierarch cryptic command fulminator mage leyline of sanctity wilt leaf liege all is dust remand Box 2 (paid 205+tax online) Tarmogoyf Elesh Norn (beginning to think this is paired up wit goyf but I'm not complaining) mox opal splinter twin foil splinter twin leyline of sanctity noble hierarch remand foil remand For about 480 bucks, I'm happy with the contents BUT if commet storm replaced either goyf, the values would have tanked. Goyf showed up really late in both boxes but I'm still happy with it (I had traded off my playset of goyfs when they hit 200 for a playset of sp mana drains so I've been goyfless for a while now).
Rabid Wo1f Member	posted May 28, 2015 07:04 PM quote: Originally posted by LandDestroyer: thanks man. i recorded both boxes. trying to upload to youtube but they are like 15-20 minute videos. the 1st one is uploaded but when i play nothing is showing up. dunno if it lags or what. will link in if they work and if you guys don't give me too hard a time about being a 32 year old who sounds like he is 18 ish :-p i got excited and rats shouldn't watch the videos. i spend the first half kinda bitching about things lol uploaded but they haven't been converted yet so you might not be able to view yet meh box https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9XriaaabUA amazeballs box https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xf-dVqCXUw foil clique at like 8:30 minutes in and goyf is in the last pack Two things, I am sad for you on that clique Also, I like how composed you were with the goyf pull
LandDestroyer Member	posted May 28, 2015 08:14 PM quote: Originally posted by Rabid Wo1f: Two things, I am sad for you on that clique Also, I like how composed you were with the goyf pull Haha...I...ermmm...aim to please :-p I've got a ton of videos of me opening new, older, foreign boosters etc. should I start posting those as well? I've had a few nice pulls over the years __________________ Back in my day you could get a soda for a quarter and an underground sea for a Hamilton.
eljaso Member	posted May 29, 2015 03:54 PM quote: Originally posted by Pail42: Wizards admits to "printing and collation issues" but doesn't actually say they'll replace damaged or incorrect product (unless you're at a GP - then they'll fix it on site). http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/modern-masters-2015-ed ition-booster-packs-2015-05-26 I googled and came up with this link https://wizards.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/10/~/replacing-defective-or-missing-pieces-from-magic-the-gathering. Also I've been communicating back and forth through customer service and it all looks as if everything will be taken care of but like I said, this is a first for me so idk.
stu55 Member	posted May 30, 2015 05:37 AM The best part of all of this is that no one made any of you open any packs at all. You KNEW that there was Comet Storm at Mythic and Hellkite Charger at rare and still went for it. As for the format itself, Sealed is super swingy and a lot of unfun things can happen due to the varying power levels of sealed decks. I like the draft format only if the people in the draft know what they are doing. Had a very strong UR deck last night and my opponent in the first round had like 2 bolts and 3 burst lightning that all got passed to him. I have gotten 2nd to last pick Vengeful Rebirths. Bad drafts lead to bad times.
daner Member	posted May 30, 2015 06:22 PM quote: Originally posted by stu55: The best part of all of this is that no one made any of you open any packs at all. You KNEW that there was Comet Storm at Mythic and Hellkite Charger at rare and still went for it. Nope. Things that are highly addictive(in this case it's basically gambling) should be banned. How dare you let us choose our own actions! You should ban or tax the hell outta these packs, they are dangerous, and we are dangerous to ourselves! Take them away like Cigarettes, make it so we can only open them in the privacy of our own home and not in public around others...wouldn't want them to get second hand pack opening fever.
mm1983 Member	posted May 31, 2015 06:13 AM Did a booster draft locally and opened a Tezzeret in pack 1, Spellskite in pack 2, and a Lodestone Golem in pack 3 so end up playing blue/white artifacts/metalcraft. Also had a Leyline of Sanctity passed to me which I didn't play but grabbed for value. Rest of the deck kinda made itself after having 2 Rusted Relics for the deck as well. I've opened much more product for personal use and trade fodder.
aethertech Member	posted May 31, 2015 10:21 AM As much as I want to open a box of MM15.....uh, the ROI is so bad...(chances of opening at least opening an easy trade value of what I paid.) After RTR, Gategrash and DM, I kinda gave up on boxes, which I normally got one from each set.
daner Member	posted May 31, 2015 10:26 AM quote: Originally posted by aethertech: As much as I want to open a box of MM15.....uh, the ROI is so bad...(chances of opening at least opening an easy trade value of what I paid.) After RTR, Gategrash and DM, I kinda gave up on boxes, which I normally got one from each set. When has ROI ever been good when cracking boxes? It's straight gambling. Magic has been around for 22 years, you guys haven't figured this out yet?
aethertech Member	posted May 31, 2015 11:05 AM quote: Originally posted by daner: When has ROI ever been good when cracking boxes? It's straight gambling. Magic has been around for 22 years, you guys haven't figured this out yet? My good luck has been a part of it - I've opened a box of every set since Lorwyn, when I started affording whole boxes, one box of each set, and never made less then double what I paid for the box. But once RtR block hit, I got a box of each and lost, then Theros block came around, and I got a single box of Journey and that was the end of that. I did open one box of Conspiracy and Modern Masters because I got them both cheap and made a nice profit on both (thanks to a foil Brainstorm in the Conspiracy box, and a really good opening of dark confident, swords, and a few other healthily priced cards. But the boxes were quite under MSRP.)
daner Member	posted May 31, 2015 05:24 PM quote: Originally posted by aethertech: My good luck has been a part of it - I've opened a box of every set since Lorwyn, when I started affording whole boxes, one box of each set, and never made less then double what I paid for the box. But once RtR block hit, I got a box of each and lost, then Theros block came around, and I got a single box of Journey and that was the end of that. I did open one box of Conspiracy and Modern Masters because I got them both cheap and made a nice profit on both (thanks to a foil Brainstorm in the Conspiracy box, and a really good opening of dark confident, swords, and a few other healthily priced cards. But the boxes were quite under MSRP.) Thats all well and good and Im happy for ya with those excellent results you use to have but you do realize you were luckily the exception...not the rule? Now your luck is evening back out.
aethertech Member	posted May 31, 2015 06:36 PM quote: Originally posted by daner: Thats all well and good and Im happy for ya with those excellent results you use to have but you do realize you were luckily the exception...not the rule? Now your luck is evening back out. And I hate it. And I'm a very "my luck is good/bad" sort of person - so as soon as it turned bad...I stopped losing money.

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