|
Author
|
Topic: Sending Rules and Liability
|
thror
Member
|
posted April 03, 2012 11:23 PM
       
Ok, so if delivery confirmation doesnt prove delivery, what do we actually need? Sig Conf? At least give us something to work with, and dont spout any more 'just get insurance' nonsense. You will lose if you have an insured package show as delivered but claim it was stolen. __________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted [19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself
|
Nitelite
Member
|
posted April 04, 2012 01:38 AM
Does anyone actually expect the sender to be responsible for mail after it reaches the mailbox outside of Hooks and Inca? I don't and I will conduct transactions under that belief. I am not going to go out of my way to get another party to agree "in writing" to something they probably agree with anyways. There is a standard here that most online retailers follow and whether MOTL wants to follow it or not, I am going to conduct transactions under that system. If a package is lost after it is "received" it's not my problem. I will not be reimbursing for that period.
|
Dragon_Summoner
Member
|
posted April 04, 2012 03:33 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Nitelite:
Does anyone actually expect the sender to be responsible for mail after it reaches the mailbox outside of Hooks and Inca? I don't and I will conduct transactions under that belief. I am not going to go out of my way to get another party to agree "in writing" to something they probably agree with anyways. There is a standard here that most online retailers follow and whether MOTL wants to follow it or not, I am going to conduct transactions under that system. If a package is lost after it is "received" it's not my problem. I will not be reimbursing for that period.
Unfortunately, it is not part of our main rules so it is classified under special agreements right now. ONes made by email. This means that you cannot just post it on your rules on your trade thread and it take effect. Nor can you expect anybody just to follow what you say. They will have to agree to it in writing. So, it will be your problem if you do not put it in your email transaction to the other trader, if it is lost between delivery and their hands. If, you dont get them to agree.
[Edited 2 times, lastly by Dragon_Summoner on April 04, 2012]
  |
hilikuS
Member
|
posted April 04, 2012 05:27 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Nitelite:
Does anyone actually expect the sender to be responsible for mail after it reaches the mailbox outside of Hooks and Inca?
Haven't seen another post from another user, and I've been following this thread from the beginning.
|
Nitelite
Member
|
posted April 06, 2012 12:57 PM
I guess Lechrac was busy this weekend too?
|
choco man
Member
|
posted April 06, 2012 04:45 PM
Asking opinions from this forum:If a buyer opts to not use DC/insurance, would you be willing to send without first having the buyer agree to accept liability for lost/stolen/damaged mail? Is that practice just simply poor attitude and unwillingness to accept responsibility? Or is that just looking out for oneself against reverse-rips.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by choco man on April 06, 2012]
|
Bagbokk
Member
|
posted April 06, 2012 04:56 PM
quote:
Originally posted by choco man:
Asking opinions from this forum:If a buyer opts to not use DC/insurance, would you be willing to send without first having the buyer agree to accept liability for lost/stolen/damaged mail? Is that practice just simply poor attitude and unwillingness to accept responsibility? Or is that just looking out for oneself against reverse-rips.
I'd be really hesitant to, though I haven't been as hard on requiring everyone to agree to accept liability as I should be and haven't had problems. My buyers recently have mostly been either high-ref/high-activity members or repeat customers, though, so I see there being extremely minimal risk. I somehow have a feeling that if I keep being lazy about it, something's going to happen sometime that'll make me regret it. I don't think it's poor attitude on either party honestly, whether the seller asks for it or the buyer refuses to waive liability. The problem is that the default rule is set a certain way, so some buyers naturally feel like they're giving something up (for nothing) when they are asked to waive liability.
|
Jazaray
Moderator
|
posted April 06, 2012 05:34 PM
quote:
Originally posted by choco man:
Asking opinions from this forum:If a buyer opts to not use DC/insurance, would you be willing to send without first having the buyer agree to accept liability for lost/stolen/damaged mail? Is that practice just simply poor attitude and unwillingness to accept responsibility? Or is that just looking out for oneself against reverse-rips.
Nope, I wouldn't. If he doesn't want to pay for the DC/Insurance, then he needs to waive. IMHO. I wouldn't send first, second or simo without them either paying for tracking, or waiving liability. Thanks,
Jazaray __________________
A Plastered Dragon Original Limerick:
There was a nice lassie named Jaz
Many wished to have what she has,
A delicate face,
A soft warm embrace,
And a whole lot of bedroom pizzazz.WeedIan: Jazaray is like MOTL's Mom. Jaz is now selling Tupperware! Help her out! ;)
|
Dragon_Summoner
Member
|
posted April 08, 2012 12:40 PM
Jaz, is there any sorta update you can give on this issue from the admin/mods end?Ben
|
Jazaray
Moderator
|
posted April 08, 2012 03:34 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Dragon_Summoner:
Jaz, is there any sorta update you can give on this issue from the admin/mods end?Ben
I would very much like to answer "yes" to this question. However, I cannot. :-\ Thanks,
Jazaray __________________
A Plastered Dragon Original Limerick:
There was a nice lassie named Jaz
Many wished to have what she has,
A delicate face,
A soft warm embrace,
And a whole lot of bedroom pizzazz.WeedIan: Jazaray is like MOTL's Mom. Jaz is now selling Tupperware! Help her out! ;)
|
Zeckk
Member
|
posted April 08, 2012 04:36 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Jazaray:
I would very much like to answer "yes" to this question. However, I cannot. :-\Thanks,
Jazaray
Is there still a discussion going on internally with the mods and admins? My worry is that this issue has been shelved until we get yet another BTA case involving a misunderstanding of DC.
|
B14ckM4g3
Member
|
posted April 08, 2012 04:48 PM
Imo, jaz is the only admin active on these forums often. perioducally is nderdog and gunslinga, but really its just jaz. truly motls mom and best admin on the servers.
thanks for at least trying to answer our questions and showing that somebody cares.
|
Jazaray
Moderator
|
posted April 08, 2012 05:56 PM
quote:
Originally posted by B14ckM4g3:
Imo, jaz is the only admin active on these forums often. perioducally is nderdog and gunslinga, but really its just jaz. truly motls mom and best admin on the servers.
thanks for at least trying to answer our questions and showing that somebody cares.
Thank you very much for the compliment, but, firstly, I'm not an admin.  Secondly, I couldn't do my job here with Ben and Jeff. They're both very great guys and they devote their time here just as much as I do.  I am, however, extremely proud to be MOTL's Mom  Yes, there has been some internal discussion of this issue, perhaps not as much as I would like, but there has been some. Thanks,
Jazaray __________________
A Plastered Dragon Original Limerick:
There was a nice lassie named Jaz
Many wished to have what she has,
A delicate face,
A soft warm embrace,
And a whole lot of bedroom pizzazz.WeedIan: Jazaray is like MOTL's Mom. Jaz is now selling Tupperware! Help her out! ;)
|
Dragon_Summoner
Member
|
posted April 08, 2012 07:36 PM
I figured there still was something going on. :-/ Oh and Jaz, thank you for "updating" . I sorta figured there was not going to be one that you could talk about but there is always hope that something came up. I too feel as B14ckM4g3 does on this issue, that this ruling business is going to disappear like an old toy under the bed. Long forgotten till it comes up again. :-p All it is going to do is cause a bunch of helabaloo like it did this time and never truly get solved. I do not speak for everyone here, I have kept my roar to a dull meow because I know how hard it is to do this as part of ones free time. I speak only once in a while, to let the mods know I am interested in this issue. :-p So hear it is Mods. I AM INTERESTED in the outcome of this and hope you guys can come to an agreement. Thanks again all who make this site what it is.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by Dragon_Summoner on April 08, 2012]
|
PortlisX
Member
|
posted April 09, 2012 10:59 PM
Date of thread start: March 9th.Current date: April 9th. Resolution and clarification: none.
|
thror
Member
|
posted April 10, 2012 12:23 AM
quote:
Originally posted by PortlisX:
Date of thread start: March 9th.Current date: April 9th. Resolution and clarification: none.
And this crap was going on at least a full week before the thread got started. Seriously shouldnt take this long. At least let us know, under the current rules, what postal service, if any, proves that my package got to its destination so that I am no longer liable for it. __________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted [19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself
|
Jazaray
Moderator
|
posted April 10, 2012 07:40 AM
quote:
Originally posted by thror:
And this crap was going on at least a full week before the thread got started. Seriously shouldnt take this long. At least let us know, under the current rules, what postal service, if any, proves that my package got to its destination so that I am no longer liable for it.
The best I can tell you right now, is Adult Signature Restricted Delivery. Thanks,
Jazaray __________________
A Plastered Dragon Original Limerick:
There was a nice lassie named Jaz
Many wished to have what she has,
A delicate face,
A soft warm embrace,
And a whole lot of bedroom pizzazz.WeedIan: Jazaray is like MOTL's Mom. Jaz is now selling Tupperware! Help her out! ;)
|
gcowhsu
Member
|
posted April 10, 2012 10:03 AM
That's an extra $5 (4.95) if you are keeping track at home.http://pe.usps.com/text/dmm300/Notice123.htm#1613376
|
ryan2754
Member
|
posted April 10, 2012 04:33 PM
Fair enough, but again the majority of my trades are $10-40. What's the problem with just getting both parties to agree on DC being enough in our circumstance? I haven't had any issues with that and I've done it in 15ish deals since this stuff got real.
|
nderdog
Moderator
|
posted April 10, 2012 05:59 PM
quote:
Originally posted by ryan2754:
Fair enough, but again the majority of my trades are $10-40. What's the problem with just getting both parties to agree on DC being enough in our circumstance? I haven't had any issues with that and I've done it in 15ish deals since this stuff got real.
There's no problem with that at all. At this point in time, unless both parties agree that DC is sufficient, if a package is lost/stolen/damaged from the time that it is delivered until the responsible party has possession, then the sender needs to compensate, but as always, if both traders have agreed to alternate liability, that's always honored. __________________
There's no need to fear, UNDERDOG is here!All your Gruul Nodorogs are belong to me. Trade them to me, please! Report rules violations. Remember the Auctions Board!
|
Nitelite
Member
|
posted April 14, 2012 03:32 PM
Maybe this will be the weekend Leshrac can take 10 minutes out of his ridiculously busy schedule and deal with an issue that is over a month old.
|
flophaus
Member
|
posted April 14, 2012 03:45 PM
You guys actually think this is ever gonna get dealt with properly? I don't.Because it already HASN'T been dealt with properly. I'm not crossing any fingers in hopes of anything. I guess the world just moves on?
|
Bagbokk
Member
|
posted April 14, 2012 04:12 PM
quote:
Originally posted by flophaus:
You guys actually think this is ever gonna get dealt with properly? I don't.Because it already HASN'T been dealt with properly. I'm not crossing any fingers in hopes of anything. I guess the world just moves on?
Probably. I think it's clear that inca thinks the current system is just fine as is, and I'd imagine Leshrac probably feels the same way (especially if this was the original intent all along) as he would've been around to establish the policy the first time too. I'm glad there's apparently been "some discussion," but neither admin probably feels a pressing need to "resolve" this issue if they don't see it as much of one to begin with. Who knows. It took a while for the price guides to get fixed and updated when INN came out, but it eventually did get updated (with exception of Commander and the like, of course). I think this is just another one of those things.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by Bagbokk on April 14, 2012]
|
thror
Member
|
posted April 14, 2012 05:15 PM
It shouldn't take 5 weeks to clarify a MAJOR site rule. This is a trading site, and we don't have a clear liability rule in place. At least edit the rules to say that Adult Signature Confirmation proves delivery, so that the few of us that read the rules would know, and maybe it would get spread by word of mouth from there when people started raising their shipping prices. I know mods can edit the rules page.__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted [19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself
|
Pharmerben
New Member
|
posted April 14, 2012 05:49 PM
This is such a joke. The most trivial things here are policed so well. Now we have a major issue and nothing is happening. What a joke.
| |
Topic Closed
Magic Online Trading League Bulletin Board
UBBFriend: Email This Page to Someone! 
