quote:

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Originally posted by rockondon:
All the vets could start by giving each other refs on the new site.
Is that slightly dishonest? yes. Do I care? no.

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/fist bump /wink

__________________
"Message to women worldwide: Girls....we're stupid. We don't like games. We don't know games. We can't read minds. Say it like you mean or STFU." -rockondon

quote:

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Originally posted by Volcanon:
You're part of the reason I hate trading anywhere now. "Value traders" are much easier to tell to buzz off. People who cause a stink over gaining or losing a couple quarters are much more frustrating to deal with. If you insist on exactly matching card values, then simply refuse the trade.

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quote:

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Originally posted by helpmehelpyou:

Lmao im hardly a value trader. If you actually knew any of my past trades you would realize ive almost always went out of my way to finish a trade. If someone wanted something of mine id always do my best to make it happen. Even if that ment taking stuff of lesser value or things i didnt want but could possibly trade locally. Its part of the reason i like point based trading. you want my stuff gimme points. Ill use those points if and when i want.

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The wrangling over 50 cents part, not the value trading part.

quote:

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Originally posted by helpmehelpyou:

Lmao im hardly a value trader. If you actually knew any of my past trades you would realize ive almost always went out of my way to finish a trade. If someone wanted something of mine id always do my best to make it happen. Even if that ment taking stuff of lesser value or things i didnt want but could possibly trade locally. Its part of the reason i like point based trading. you want my stuff gimme points. Ill use those points if and when i want.

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If this site were to just die tomorrow or whatever day as some expect you'd lose all those refs anyways.

quote:

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Originally posted by Vegas10:
My issue with most point based lists on here is somehow the same card if it is mine is worth less points than if it is yours so I don't even waste time looking at them anymore (maybe yours aren't that way just my experience in general).

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Ok i can see the confusioN. Im talking about pucas point system. not the point system people use here on motl.

Ppl on motl value your CARDS and give them a point value they want. Puca just has 1 point value 1 = a penny.

We just want updates to what we currently have......

I don't want to start over. I wont be starting over. I would rather just stick with the current MOTL we have if we have to start over.

I use Puca now and I can tell you that a new MOTL would really have to up its game to pull new users.

quote:

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Originally posted by helpmehelpyou:

Ok i can see the confusioN. Im talking about pucas point system. not the point system people use here on motl.

Ppl on motl value your CARDS and give them a point value they want. Puca just has 1 point value 1 = a penny.

Motl users point system can be completely different person to person. I do NOT like point based posts on motl either.

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quote:

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Originally posted by ronandaggy:
Sure you'd have to start over, just like joining any other site. Everyone would. More than likely peeps would know who you are anyways.

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Yeah this makes sense. I mean, I have a decent chunk of refs, but thinking back to when I started to deal on Salvation, I got up to 100 refs in less than a year's time. People will recognize a lot of the members here provided they have the same or a similar name on the new site.

This solves the issue of giving former motl members the respect they deserve and gives new membrrs a fair shake. I know im coming from the opinion of a relatively new person so please if any old members disagree let me know why. I just feel this gives the veterans thr respect they deserve yet would still give new comers a feel that they wernt coming into a rigged system.

quote:

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Originally posted by mini1337s:
Refs shouldn't carry for the site, BUT you should be given the option to show previous MOTL refs (would need some sort of verification system) through skme sort of "Feedback from other trading sites" tab. Honestly, any site, whether Puca or Sally should show but not count to your MOTL 2.0 refs.
Just gives you a better idea of who you are trading with.

If refs carry, only the past 3 years should be relevant. 1k refs doesn't mean much to me when 5 are from the last 3 years.

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Not transfer it refs, really starting to look torrid imo and not of interest to join.

__________________
30th in refs on Motl!

#1 Ref's for Arizona!

I offer 3rd party trading services. Email if interested.

quote:

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Originally posted by ronandaggy:
Also I think aggys preggers and Dons looking mighty suspect

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by the way can you let her know she left her purse at my house

I like keeping current style and don't mind editing my list when I make a trade. No pictures unless mods. Puca trade exists and works but I don't think we shouldn't just mirror them. BTA and CBT list and moderators are a must. Trade matcher is a must.
Linking trades in the system is nice. No initial membership fee but maybe a premier membership fee, which say gets you access to the rules violations and suggestions and "updates from the mods" message boards.
I like the idea of a "preferred member" designation for motl transfer members with say >75 refs, like the gold star or something, and then new members get that distinction at say 100 refs. But not necessarily transferring refs. This designation will suffice, imo. New start, new user names, new url.

Essentially I agree with slurpee and daner. Rockondon makes a good point. If all the big ref members all join, and you've traded before (which most of us still around with over 100 refs have over the course of the past several years) we'd all start out with say 35-50 references from the beginning. Daner is right, having your "non motl new users" have a stable of old motl users to trade with and show they are reputable members would only help the reputation of the new site, while also appeasing those of us that have been through the grind of online trading.

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Originally posted by revenger:
So, some Of you all want a point system? Wonderbar it's pucatrade part 2 now instead of A Motl offspring.

Not transfer it refs, really starting to look torrid imo and not of interest to join.

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Obviously you guys with tons of refs should get some credit but I'm curious now.
What would you do if this site crashed tomorrow? Would your online trading career end? Would you never join another site?

quote:

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Originally posted by ronandaggy:
Obviously you guys with tons of refs should get some credit but I'm curious now.
What would you do if this site crashed tomorrow? Would your online trading career end? Would you never join another site?

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Actually for general purposes I really don't trade anymore. Well on here that is. However, as an established Motl trader with an impeccable track record, sending first is not a requirement for me, as well as not having to start over. Starting all over beyond hella sucks. New sites sucks. Ohhhhh you want examples?? Allow me.
Mtgsalvation; sent out a burn of the grovewillows first. Ripped. Mtgsavaltion says I am at fault.
Deckbox.org; sent out a scalding tarn to the UK. (And another top $ card I forget which was). Ripped. Deckbox says there is nothing they can do bout it (thus endorsing ripping).
Sure Motl doesn't get the traffic as say pucatrade (which you can also get ripped off as well) but it gets more than enough for me than the sites that have ripped me off.

If the new site does not acknowledge that for me, why join? Why start over when you don't have to.

__________________
30th in refs on Motl!

#1 Ref's for Arizona!

I offer 3rd party trading services. Email if interested.

quote:

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Originally posted by revenger:

Actually for general purposes I really don't trade anymore. Well on here that is. However, as an established Motl trader with an impeccable track record, sending first is not a requirement for me, as well as not having to start over. Starting all over beyond hella sucks. New sites sucks. Ohhhhh you want examples?? Allow me.
Mtgsalvation; sent out a burn of the grovewillows first. Ripped. Mtgsavaltion says I am at fault.
Deckbox.org; sent out a scalding tarn to the UK. (And another top $ card I forget which was). Ripped. Deckbox says there is nothing they can do bout it (thus endorsing ripping).
Sure Motl doesn't get the traffic as say pucatrade (which you can also get ripped off as well) but it gets more than enough for me than the sites that have ripped me off.

If the new site does not acknowledge that for me, why join? Why start over when you don't have to.

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Yes, you're rep is good, I get it. Mine was with wotc where I was a mod before it got revamped and I started over.

Wth did I ask for examples of where you've been ripped off. Almost everyone on here's been ripped off. I asked what you'd do if the site crashed.

Starting over sucks, I get it. But it's not why start over if you don't have to. If this site goes your motl rep goes. Guess what, we all gotta start over.

Again, I'm not saying dot bring refs, i personally don't care. I've offered to assist the man Dave with the funding based on the fact that I like the people.
I just don't like the whole it's gotta be this way junk.

quote:

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Originally posted by ronandaggy:
Yes, you're rep is good, I get it. Mine was with wotc where I was a mod before it got revamped and I started over.

Wth did I ask for examples of where you've been ripped off. Almost everyone on here's been ripped off. I asked what you'd do if the site crashed.

Starting over sucks, I get it. But it's not why start over if you don't have to. If this site goes your motl rep goes. Guess what, we all gotta start over.

Again, I'm not saying dot bring refs, i personally don't care. I've offered to assist the man Dave with the funding based on the fact that I like the people.
I just don't like the whole it's gotta be this way junk.

Edit* people work hard on their refs and I'm not against bringing them, I just things need to be open for discussion

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If the site crashed, well then I couldn't discuss and post on the forums anymore. That alone would be the greatest loss to me. I really do not trade anymore. So it wouldn't be that much of a loss imo.

__________________
30th in refs on Motl!

#1 Ref's for Arizona!

I offer 3rd party trading services. Email if interested.

quote:

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Originally posted by mm1983:
If obtaining refs can be done the same way with a new trading site as it can be done here on MOTL everybody can simply resend ref checks out to the people they have traded with. For some of us would mean looking through a couple hundred emails but that's really about the only way you would be able to keep a decent amount of refs that anyone has earned here on MOTL.

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BUT, that being said, if everyone started over, it would be fine with me. A new, up to date site that is being monitored and maintained tops losing my refs. It would be nice however if you could somehow get a remark or something that on 'MOTL 1' you had x refs before the switch.

Moving on, all this would be gone if we could/would install a system like on MKM (magickardmarket). It requires a third party though, and he/she could demand some compensation in some form.
With MKM, if I sell something the buyer pays to MKM. They confirm to me that the buyer has paid but won't release the money until he has received. (sending registered is the key here).
If (for smaller trades for instance) people want to bypass this system, it's for their own risk and MOTL 2 won't be held liable for lost mail or disputes.

Refs could/can be given via this system, though a successfull remark after each trade/sell would suffice. People can see what the trade was for instance and with whom they traded.

That takes care of the ref system and the 'you send first' bonanza. Everyone sends at the same time, thus it becomes fair. Also the bar is lowered for newer members.
Only thing is, you need 3rd parties.

All sorts of options can be added of course. I am no programmer or web designer, having nothing to add to this. I don't know what it would cost or how much effort is required.
I would donate to the stack and set it up, but that's about all I can do. I wouldn't mind being in a 'think-tank' (2U, enchantment, Odyssey if you remember it) about what the new site should look like/contain/etc.

Lastly, before this topic becomes 'just a topic' or one of those ideas you think up while drinking in a bar with your friends and never really happens, I say we should appoint a project leader. One that oversees the process, delegates tasks to those people who have volunteered/offered their services. Otherwise this will grow cold in the end.

my thoughts:

- appoint a project leader
- appoint a task force (who is willing to do what)

and they should decide on:

- what is needed to get started (servers, money, etc)
- do they need an extra 'think-tank'
- etc.

I suggest this happens behind the screens of MOTL 1, while an appointed person in the task force frequently informs the Forums of the status.

All other topics/subjects are irrelevant until a start is made. Perhaps one of us is a project leader in real life, that experience could help.

Bottomline is, if everyone just keeps posting here (which is fine of course), it will never see the light of day. If there is any way I can help I will gladly assist. I suppose I have good organizing skills, generally have good ideas inside projects (I volunteer for being in a 'think-tank' should it come to be) and I can add to the Stack.

__________________
I'm a geek, you're a geek. Let's trade.

quote:

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Originally posted by AEther Storm:
stuff, scroll up.

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quote:

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Originally posted by AEther Storm:
my thoughts:

- appoint a project leader
- appoint a task force (who is willing to do what)

and they should decide on:

- what is needed to get started (servers, money, etc)
- do they need an extra 'think-tank'
- etc.

I suggest this happens behind the screens of MOTL 1, while an appointed person in the task force frequently informs the Forums of the status.

All other topics/subjects are irrelevant until a start is made. Perhaps one of us is a project leader in real life, that experience could help.

Bottomline is, if everyone just keeps posting here (which is fine of course), it will never see the light of day. If there is any way I can help I will gladly assist. I suppose I have good organizing skills, generally have good ideas inside projects (I volunteer for being in a 'think-tank' should it come to be) and I can add to the Stack.

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I think Gawain had volunteered to project lead. I agree we need to have some structure in place at some point or we may never leave the "good idea" stage.

Maybe everyone who truly wants to be part could reply with simply your skills / availability and someone could build a facebook group etc to actively discuss these things.

It would be really great to see this gain traction and start moving towards the new site!

Tim

The only time I've ever been ripped off was when I was new and traded with other new members. I've never been ripped off by sending first to an established member. The problem with starting over again on a brand new site is that there are no established members. Everyone has zero refs, including the people I can trust and the people I can't. What that would mean is, if refs aren't transfered, I wouldn't trade at all in the first 6 months or so until the people I can trust become more obvious (high ref members). That's the biggest problem I see as a deterrent for new people to join, especially those with established histories.