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Author Topic:   The Rulings Thread, part 43 (ALL rules-related questions go HERE!)
WestWycke
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posted June 04, 2009 09:21 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for WestWycke Click Here to Email WestWycke Send a private message to WestWycke Click to send WestWycke an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by marriedwithchildern:
I have just cast Yawgmoths win, and start to play spells from my graveyard. I cast Ancestral Recall targeting me and my opponent casts misdirection. Now I have two Force of Wills in my yard, since the Will allows me to play cards in my graveyard as though they were in my hand could I remove one Force to the other Force to counter his Misdirection?

Ethersworn Canonist says this "Each player who has played a nonartifact spell this turn can't play additional nonartifact spells." Does this count just for the turn that it comes into play or every turn?



No, you may not use a blue card that is in the graveyard to pay the alternate cost of FoW. The only thing that Yawgmoth's Will allows you to do is to play cards from your graveyard.


The Ethersworn Canonist has a static ability that is always on. This ability creates a game rule that is constantly aware of whether a player has played a non-artifact spell this turn. If they have, they can't play another one.

__________________
"If you're right 90% of the time, why quibble about the other 3% ?"

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good."


[Edited 1 times, lastly by WestWycke on June 04, 2009]

 
Kryne
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posted June 05, 2009 09:37 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Kryne Send a private message to Kryne Click to send Kryne an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
If I have a Treetop Village out and wait until my declare attackers phase to turn it into a 3/3 trampler, can I still declare it as an attacker?

And if I can, can someone tap it (say with cryptic command, or something else at instant speed) right after I turn it into a 3/3 but right before I declare it to attack, thus stopping it from being able to attack?

Thanks, nerd-squad.

By which I mean, people who are better at Magic than I am.

 
iheartp9
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posted June 05, 2009 09:56 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for iheartp9 Click Here to Email iheartp9 Send a private message to iheartp9 Click to send iheartp9 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View iheartp9's Have/Want ListView iheartp9's Have/Want List
It sort of all depends on if you announce your actions in a single motion. If you say "Declare attackers', then have a pause for responses then try to animate, it's too late. But if you do everything at once "attack, attack, animate and attack" then what you've done is out of order sequencing and you'll have the opportunity to back up and animate at the appropriate time.

Once you've animated your mutavault (which happens during the beginning of combat step), you get priority and then your opponent gets priority, meaning they would have a chance to cryptic tapping your team.

 
Kryne
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posted June 05, 2009 11:42 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Kryne Send a private message to Kryne Click to send Kryne an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
So, just to be absolutely clear--I can't animate the manlands during the declare attackers phase if I want them to attack that turn?
The last chance I would get to do so would be during the "start of combat" phase?
 
OGB
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posted June 05, 2009 11:48 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for OGB Click Here to Email OGB Send a private message to OGB Click to send OGB an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View OGB's Have/Want ListView OGB's Have/Want List
That's correct. Literally the only thing you are allowed to do during the "declare attackers" phase is declare attackers.
 
WestWycke
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posted June 05, 2009 12:20 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for WestWycke Click Here to Email WestWycke Send a private message to WestWycke Click to send WestWycke an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by OGB:
That's correct. Literally the only thing you are allowed to do during the "declare attackers" phase is declare attackers.


That is not correct. You can do lots of things during the declare attackers phase. However, the first thing that must be done is declare all attackers.

Here's a nice summary I copied from a post by subx over at MTGSalvation.

Beginning Combat - both players receive priority - This is the last chance to do things like tapping creatures, or activating manlands for attacking (once you both pass priority with the stack empty, the next step happens immediately and attackers are declared)

Declare attackers - attackers are declared BEFORE players receive priority, after they are declared both players receive priority, tapping or untapping a creature doesn't remove it from combat, unless the card specifically says to do so (ie: Maze of Ith - This is the last chance to activate manlands for blocking, things like Qasali Ambusher, or tapping blockers so they can't block (again this is because once you both pass priority, blockers are declared immediately)

Declare blockers - blockers are declared BEFORE players receive priority, after they are declared both players receive priority, tapping or untapping a creature does not remove it as a blocker, and even REMOVING the creature from play doesn't mean the attacker is unblocked (if it doesn't have trample, it will deal no combat damage) - This is the last chance to do things that would affect the damage a creature will cause, for instance Giant Growth: if you don't play it now, it won't do the extra 3 damage (technically you could cast it between first and normal damage, but that wouldn't generally be a good play)

Damage - damage goes on the stack, and then both players receive priority - note that it does use the stack, you can still do things like increase your creatures toughness to save it, or in the case of Mogg Fanatic put it's ability on the stack, and it will still deal its combat damage (If something has first strike or double strike, there's two combat damage steps, and both use the same order of events). After all players pass priority with the stack empty, damage resolves.

End Combat - Generally not much happens here, but it is the last chance to do things before moving into a players 2nd main phase.

__________________
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"I intend to live forever. So far, so good."

 
caquaa
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posted June 05, 2009 01:01 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for caquaa Click Here to Email caquaa Send a private message to caquaa Click to send caquaa an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by OGB:
That's correct. Literally the only thing you are allowed to do during the "declare attackers" phase is declare attackers.

Declare attackers step, and the one directly following that is declare blockers so I hope I get a chance to do something in there

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If at first you don’t succeed, failure may be your style.

 
Odin_Tanafres
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posted June 07, 2009 06:25 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Odin_Tanafres Click Here to Email Odin_Tanafres Send a private message to Odin_Tanafres Click to send Odin_Tanafres an Instant MessageVisit Odin_Tanafres's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Odin_Tanafres's Have/Want ListView Odin_Tanafres's Have/Want List
Are Planeswalkers able to be put into play through Oath of Druids? I know they're not creatures, but are played as creature spells. Just wanted to clarify this and get a more positive answer as I am unsure. Thanks!

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JoshSherman
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posted June 07, 2009 03:48 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for JoshSherman Click Here to Email JoshSherman Send a private message to JoshSherman Click to send JoshSherman an Instant MessageVisit JoshSherman's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View JoshSherman's Have/Want ListView JoshSherman's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by Odin_Tanafres:
Are Planeswalkers able to be put into play through Oath of Druids? I know they're not creatures, but are played as creature spells.

No, they are not played as creature spells. They are played as planeswalker spells. Just like a sorcery, or instant among others, they can be countered with a Negate, but not with a Remove Soul.

The answer to your question is also no. An Oath of Druids cannot put a planeswalker into play.

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Kryne
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posted June 09, 2009 04:14 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Kryne Send a private message to Kryne Click to send Kryne an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
If you have a Runed Halo out with "Banefire" called and someone tries to Banefire you in the face for 5 or more, they cannot because in addition to preventing damage, "protection" does not allow targeting from whatever the protection is for.

Right or wrong?

 
Our_Benefactors
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posted June 09, 2009 06:26 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Our_Benefactors Click Here to Email Our_Benefactors Send a private message to Our_Benefactors Click to send Our_Benefactors an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Kryne:
If you have a Runed Halo out with "Banefire" called and someone tries to Banefire you in the face for 5 or more, they cannot because in addition to preventing damage, "protection" does not allow targeting from whatever the protection is for.

Right or wrong?


correct

 
stacker
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posted June 09, 2009 08:25 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for stacker Click Here to Email stacker Send a private message to stacker Click to send stacker an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View stacker's Have/Want ListView stacker's Have/Want List
about dredging...

say you brainstorm, can you dredge upon any of the 3 cards you draw? like can you draw 2 cards, then use dredge instead of the 3rd card? as well as can you draw 1 card, dredge instead of drawing the 2nd, then draw the 3rd card?

 
iheartp9
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posted June 09, 2009 09:07 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for iheartp9 Click Here to Email iheartp9 Send a private message to iheartp9 Click to send iheartp9 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View iheartp9's Have/Want ListView iheartp9's Have/Want List
Sure, you can dredge in any of the instances you mentioned, so long as you have at least the appropriate number of cards in your library.
 
Kryne
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posted June 11, 2009 12:10 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Kryne Send a private message to Kryne Click to send Kryne an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
So, I'm preempting the rule change with some dumb questions before hand.

I realize the Mogg Fantastic "2 points of damage" tricks no longer work. This is upsetting. What does that mean with regard to following:

If I assign a creature, say, Mogg Fantastic, to block, and sacrifice it after assigning blockers to deal one point of damage to, say the other player, is the creature it was blocking still blocked? And/or is no combat damage dealt? Or is it unblocked now that M.F. is popped?

Thanks in advance.

 
Bugger
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posted June 11, 2009 12:14 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Bugger Click Here to Email Bugger Send a private message to Bugger Click to send Bugger an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Kryne:
So, I'm preempting the rule change with some dumb questions before hand.

I realize the Mogg Fantastic "2 points of damage" tricks no longer work. This is upsetting. What does that mean with regard to following:

If I assign a creature, say, Mogg Fantastic, to block, and sacrifice it after assigning blockers to deal one point of damage to, say the other player, is the creature it was blocking still blocked? And/or is no combat damage dealt? Or is it unblocked now that M.F. is popped?

Thanks in advance.


I just asked this same question on the Wizards forums site, and the answer I recieved (I asked about STE) was that the creature you block remains blocked, but no damage is dealt to or by the creature sacrificed. So Mogg Fanatic, when blocking, now presents you with the same choice you now have to make when attacking under the new rules.

 
caquaa
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posted June 11, 2009 03:15 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for caquaa Click Here to Email caquaa Send a private message to caquaa Click to send caquaa an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
If you're attacked and mogg fanatic blocks then before damage you sac it, creatures with trample can still assign damage to the defending player. It makes trample slightly more valuable I guess, but only vs things people are goign to sac which is far and few between.

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Mr.C
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posted June 13, 2009 01:27 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Mr.C Click Here to Email Mr.C Send a private message to Mr.C Click to send Mr.C an Instant MessageVisit Mr.C's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Does damage stay after combat with the new rules?

i.e., I swing into a goblin king and a lackey or whatever with a 3/3, do i kill the king, and the lackey dies after combat?

 
WestWycke
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posted June 13, 2009 07:23 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for WestWycke Click Here to Email WestWycke Send a private message to WestWycke Click to send WestWycke an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Assuming you choose to assign damage first to the king and then the lackey, then they will both die.

King takes two, Lackey takes one.
State-based effects are checked, see King with lethal damage, off to graveyard it goes.
Since something happened, state-based effects check again. Lackey no longer has +1/+1 and is a 1/1 with one damage, so it joins the King in the graveyard.

The rules update does nothing with how damage works. All the relevant changes to damage are in how damage gets distributed in combat, and with some abilities that are associated with damage (deathtouch, lifelink).

Damage still stays on the creature until end of turn, and wither damage is still done to creatures in the form of -1/-1 counters.

__________________
"If you're right 90% of the time, why quibble about the other 3% ?"

"I intend to live forever. So far, so good."

 
evilempire22
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posted June 13, 2009 09:29 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for evilempire22 Click Here to Email evilempire22 Send a private message to evilempire22 Click to send evilempire22 an Instant MessageVisit evilempire22's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View evilempire22's Have/Want ListView evilempire22's Have/Want List
Situation came up during a multiplayer game over lunch the other day:

Player A has a Necroskitter in play.

Player B has a Prince of Thralls in play.

Player C has a creature with a -1/-1 counter on it.

If Player C's creature goes to the graveyard, what is the order of events if it happened on:

1. Player A's turn

2. Player B's turn

3. Player C's turn


Thanks in advance!

--Evil

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[Edited 1 times, lastly by evilempire22 on June 13, 2009]

 
skizzikmonger
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posted June 14, 2009 12:49 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for skizzikmonger Send a private message to skizzikmonger Click to send skizzikmonger an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I'm a little unsure of how Braid of Fire works within the new rules. How I'm interpreting the rules and BoF, the mana from Braid of Fire goes away after your upkeep and before your main phase, which only allows you to play instants with the mana, and defeats the purpose of having a ton of mana. Am I wrong in my interpretation? If so, how?
 
Our_Benefactors
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posted June 14, 2009 12:52 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Our_Benefactors Click Here to Email Our_Benefactors Send a private message to Our_Benefactors Click to send Our_Benefactors an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by skizzikmonger:
I'm a little unsure of how Braid of Fire works within the new rules. How I'm interpreting the rules and BoF, the mana from Braid of Fire goes away after your upkeep and before your main phase, which only allows you to play instants with the mana, and defeats the purpose of having a ton of mana. Am I wrong in my interpretation? If so, how?

The way BoF used to work was that it would add mana in your upkeep, which could be used during your upkeep and draw step, since they were part of the "beginning phase". The way it works now is that you can only use it in your upkeep, but it won't burn you. The implication this has is that you can't use the mana from BoF to pay for the card you draw for the turn. BoF could NEVER be used to pay for spells in your main phase (barring Upwelling).

 
JoshSherman
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posted June 14, 2009 01:23 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for JoshSherman Click Here to Email JoshSherman Send a private message to JoshSherman Click to send JoshSherman an Instant MessageVisit JoshSherman's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View JoshSherman's Have/Want ListView JoshSherman's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by evilempire22:
Situation came up during a multiplayer game over lunch the other day:

Player A has a Necroskitter in play.

Player B has a Prince of Thralls in play.

Player C has a creature with a -1/-1 counter on it.

If Player C's creature goes to the graveyard, what is the order of events if it happened on:

1. Player A's turn
2. Player B's turn
3. Player C's turn


On Players C and A's turns, Player B's trigger will resolve first. If Player C does not pay three life, Player B gets the creature. If Player C does, player A's trigger will resolve, "giving" the creature to player A.

On Player B's turn, player A's trigger resolves first, so s/he gets the creature. Player C still has to choose whether or not to pay 3 life, but not doing so won't do anything.

 
farsk8dutch
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posted June 14, 2009 03:34 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for farsk8dutch Click Here to Email farsk8dutch Send a private message to farsk8dutch Click to send farsk8dutch an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View farsk8dutch's Have/Want ListView farsk8dutch's Have/Want List
Do you still draw a card from Sensei's Divining Top's activated ability, while it's on the stack, once it is sacrificed in order to cast Shrapnel Blast?
 
Our_Benefactors
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posted June 14, 2009 04:15 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Our_Benefactors Click Here to Email Our_Benefactors Send a private message to Our_Benefactors Click to send Our_Benefactors an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by farsk8dutch:
Do you still draw a card from Sensei's Divining Top's activated ability, while it's on the stack, once it is sacrificed in order to cast Shrapnel Blast?

yes

 
Sliver King
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posted June 18, 2009 11:36 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Sliver King Click Here to Email Sliver King Send a private message to Sliver King Click to send Sliver King an Instant MessageVisit Sliver King's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I am at 3 life when my opponent attacks me with an Incurable Ogre and and a Tower Gargoyle. If I block the ogre with a Mycoid Shepherd and do not block the gargoyle, will I be able to survive the attack due to the shepherd's graveyard trigger?

 

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