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Author Topic:   Rulings Thread Part 48 (ALL rules-related questions go HERE!)
whitemage57
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posted May 15, 2011 09:15 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for whitemage57 Click Here to Email whitemage57 Send a private message to whitemage57 Click to send whitemage57 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View whitemage57's Have/Want ListView whitemage57's Have/Want List
If I cast Archive Trap in response to someone playing a card that has them search their library, do I get to top their 13 cards first or do they get to search first?
 
Cyno
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posted May 15, 2011 09:22 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Cyno Click Here to Email Cyno Send a private message to Cyno Click to send Cyno an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
you get to mill them for 13 first.

edit: Archive trap will still cost 5 to cast as that point.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by Cyno on May 15, 2011]

 
darius vitrosoo
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posted May 15, 2011 10:31 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for darius vitrosoo Click Here to Email darius vitrosoo Send a private message to darius vitrosoo Click to send darius vitrosoo an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
i have a further question about the spellskite. i play a quicksilver gyser and one of my targets is the skite can my opponent make both targets the skite? i think not as i cannot target same thing twice as the spell says "2 target pemanents"

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thror
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posted May 15, 2011 10:33 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
You are correct, quicksilver geyser must have 2 different targets.

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Timmyhill
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posted May 15, 2011 12:14 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Timmyhill Click Here to Email Timmyhill Send a private message to Timmyhill Click to send Timmyhill an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Timmyhill's Have/Want ListView Timmyhill's Have/Want List
I've got 2 questions

when is a spell considered casted?

i had an opponent tap mana say he's playing a spell, put it face up on the table, start pointing at creatures saying which ones are dead...

then once it became clear more of my creatures would live and he would lose all his blockers and lose on my next turn, pick up the card he played, untapped his lands and told me to go as if nothing happened.

when i called him out on this he said he hadnt wanted to play it and his turn was over and i should go. it was at FNM and i called over the guy who does most of our judgeing he said to just keep playing. which i dont think was right.

Also whats considered stalling?
then on top of that my opponent proceeds to take 3-4 mins per turn even tho he's got 1 card in hand just to run us out of time and into turns.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by Timmyhill on May 15, 2011]

 
Zakman86
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posted May 15, 2011 12:25 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Zakman86 Click Here to Email Zakman86 Send a private message to Zakman86 Click to send Zakman86 an Instant MessageVisit Zakman86's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Zakman86's Have/Want ListView Zakman86's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by Timmyhill:
I've got 2 questions

when is a spell concerted casted?

i had an opponent tap mana say he's playing a spell, put it face up on the table, start pointing at creatures saying which ones are dead...

then once it became clear more of my creatures would live and he would lose all his blockers and lose on my next turn, pick up the card he played, untapped his lands and told me to go as if nothing happened.

when i called him out on this he said he hadnt wanted to play it and his turn was over and i should go. it was at FNM and i called over the guy who does most of our judgeing he said to just keep playing. which i dont think was right.

Also whats concerted stalling?
then on top of that my opponent proceeds to take 3-4 mins per turn even tho he's got 1 card in hand just to run us out of time and into turns.


the word's considered, not concerted. :P

In Regular REL, what your opponent did in the first situation isn't really bad, though if you really want to be a douche you can argue about it, but I'd probably just say the same thing as the TO did. FNMs aren't generally very competitive.

The second case is CLEARLY stalling.

 
Timmyhill
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posted May 15, 2011 12:54 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Timmyhill Click Here to Email Timmyhill Send a private message to Timmyhill Click to send Timmyhill an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Timmyhill's Have/Want ListView Timmyhill's Have/Want List
I stepped right into that one... its been a really long weekend... atleast you knew what I meant.

As for our FNM its pretty competitive. First place gets between 8 and 12 packs depending on how many show up. I guess I dont see how it can be within the rules to take back a spell after its been played.

 
yukizora
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posted May 15, 2011 02:11 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for yukizora Click Here to Email yukizora Send a private message to yukizora Click to send yukizora an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Timmyhill:
I stepped right into that one... its been a really long weekend... atleast you knew what I meant.

As for our FNM its pretty competitive. First place gets between 8 and 12 packs depending on how many show up. I guess I dont see how it can be within the rules to take back a spell after its been played.



"Pretty Competitive", "Take back a spell"

Sorry what?

I'd seriously consider telling your locals that's not how things work.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by yukizora on May 15, 2011]

 
Sovarius
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posted May 15, 2011 02:57 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Sovarius Click Here to Email Sovarius Send a private message to Sovarius Click to send Sovarius an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Sovarius's Trade Auction or SaleView Sovarius's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by Soldier Boi:
1. Can I use Lotus Cobra's abiliy to play Myr Superion?

2. Lets say I have Spellskite and Precursor Golem in play. My opponenet plays lightning bot on the golem. Can I switch all 3?


1. Yes you can, the mana comes from the triggered ability of the Cobra - a creature. generally creature mana comes from activated abilities, which might be why you're questioning this one, but it doesn't matter, it still comes from the creature.

2. Sure you can, but you still need to activate it for each copy. It doesn't matter that the spell is a copy or hard cast from hand or anything like that. As long as you can target the spell or ability you're fine.

quote:
Originally posted by Timmyhill:
Stuff

Also whats considered stalling?
then on top of that my opponent proceeds to take 3-4 mins per turn even tho he's got 1 card in hand just to run us out of time and into turns.


If it is sanctioned, you certainly can choose how picky you want to be and argue that you're not losing any matches/points because someone read their cards wrong/did math wrong/didn't comprehend the game state, or whatever. that is part of the competitive side of the game for sure.
If it's not sanctioned or you're not playing for prizes your TO might say taking a move back within a certain period of time is alright. You could argue it still but i don't know where that would get you. Accidents do happen.

If he's clearly stalling, that is horsey doo-doo. Getting by on a technicality like that is not part of being competitive and that is why it is a rule you must maintain a certain rate of play and keep the game state progressing. You are definitely within your rights to tell the TO - that is basically cheating and specifically not a loophole to be abused as in some sports.

 
Absurd90
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posted May 16, 2011 02:32 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Absurd90 Click Here to Email Absurd90 Send a private message to Absurd90 Click to send Absurd90 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Spellskite.

I have Pyromancer's Ascension with 2 counters on it and I cast Lightning Bolt, can my opponent change the target of the copied Bolt as well with the Spellskite?

 
TimeBeing
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posted May 16, 2011 02:33 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for TimeBeing Click Here to Email TimeBeing Send a private message to TimeBeing Click to send TimeBeing an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Absurd90:
Spellskite.

I have Pyromancer's Ascension with 2 counters on it and I cast Lightning Bolt, can my opponent change the target of the copied Bolt as well with the Spellskite?


yes but he would have to activate it twice.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by TimeBeing on May 16, 2011]

 
michaelsean09
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posted May 17, 2011 04:46 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for michaelsean09 Click Here to Email michaelsean09 Send a private message to michaelsean09 Click to send michaelsean09 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Last night in a casual game my friend selected a scalding tarn as one of the permanents he was sacrificing to phyrexian obliterater. He then sacrificed it to get his land claiming this was completely legal. I didn't make a big deal because it was completely casual but this didn't seem right to me. Is it?
 
Myy
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posted May 17, 2011 06:53 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Myy Click Here to Email Myy Send a private message to Myy Click to send Myy an Instant MessageVisit Myy's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Myy's Have/Want ListView Myy's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by michaelsean09:
Last night in a casual game my friend selected a scalding tarn as one of the permanents he was sacrificing to phyrexian obliterater. He then sacrificed it to get his land claiming this was completely legal. I didn't make a big deal because it was completely casual but this didn't seem right to me. Is it?

Nope, it isn't correct. He either has to sac for the Obliterator ( and therefor can not sacrifice it again for the effect) or sac it for the effect and sac another permanent in it's place.

I hope that was clear

 
michaelsean09
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posted May 17, 2011 07:18 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for michaelsean09 Click Here to Email michaelsean09 Send a private message to michaelsean09 Click to send michaelsean09 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Myy:
Nope, it isn't correct. He either has to sac for the Obliterator ( and therefor can not sacrifice it again for the effect) or sac it for the effect and sac another permanent in it's place.

I hope that was clear


Yep that's exactly the way I explained it actually. Thanks for conformation.

 
gcowhsu
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posted May 18, 2011 02:32 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for gcowhsu Click Here to Email gcowhsu Click to send gcowhsu an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View gcowhsu's Trade Auction or SaleView gcowhsu's Trade Auction or Sale
I have a sword of feast or famine and I equip it to a creature. Later I play Tezz AOB and make the sword 5/5. Can the creature w/ the sword equipped and the sword itself attack or do they attack separately or does the creature with the sword equipped only attack.

It would seem that the creature with the sword equipped and the sword itself could attack.

Also can the 5/5 sword equip itself so it can get the feast and famine bonuses.

 
yakusoku
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posted May 18, 2011 02:52 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for yakusoku Click Here to Email yakusoku Send a private message to yakusoku Click to send yakusoku an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by gcowhsu:
I have a sword of feast or famine and I equip it to a creature. Later I play Tezz AOB and make the sword 5/5. Can the creature w/ the sword equipped and the sword itself attack or do they attack separately or does the creature with the sword equipped only attack.

It would seem that the creature with the sword equipped and the sword itself could attack.

Also can the 5/5 sword equip itself so it can get the feast and famine bonuses.


If you make the Sword a 5/5, it stops equipping the creature. Both of them can attack separately, but the creature won't be equipped with a Sword.

quote:
Comprehensive Rules:

301.5c An Equipment that's also a creature can't equip a creature. An Equipment that loses the subtype "Equipment" can't equip a creature. An Equipment can't equip itself. An Equipment that equips an illegal or nonexistent permanent becomes unattached from that permanent but remains on the battlefield. (This is a state-based action. See rule 704.)


 
caquaa
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posted May 18, 2011 03:01 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for caquaa Click Here to Email caquaa Send a private message to caquaa Click to send caquaa an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View caquaa's Trade Auction or SaleView caquaa's Trade Auction or Sale

301.5c. An Equipment that’s also a creature can’t equip a creature. An Equipment that loses the subtype “Equipment” can’t equip a creature. An Equipment can’t equip itself. An Equipment that equips an illegal or nonexistent permanent becomes unattached from that permanent but remains on the battlefield. (This is a state-based action. See rule 704.)

edit: beat me to it ;p

[Edited 1 times, lastly by caquaa on May 18, 2011]

 
flavor_of_the_weak
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posted May 19, 2011 04:38 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for flavor_of_the_weak Send a private message to flavor_of_the_weak Click to send flavor_of_the_weak an Instant MessageVisit flavor_of_the_weak's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View flavor_of_the_weak's Have/Want ListView flavor_of_the_weak's Have/Want List
I uses Unnatural Selection to change lets say Myr Superion to a dragon.Is it both dragon/myr or just a dragon?


Unnatural Selection
{1}: Choose a creature type other than Wall. Target creature becomes that type until end of turn.

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[Edited 1 times, lastly by flavor_of_the_weak on May 19, 2011]

 
caquaa
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posted May 19, 2011 05:33 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for caquaa Click Here to Email caquaa Send a private message to caquaa Click to send caquaa an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View caquaa's Trade Auction or SaleView caquaa's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by flavor_of_the_weak:
I uses Unnatural Selection to change lets say Myr Superion to a dragon.Is it both dragon/myr or just a dragon?

it would be a dragon and only a dragon. Unnatural selection does not make use of any "in addition" type phrase.

 
Sovarius
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posted May 21, 2011 01:15 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Sovarius Click Here to Email Sovarius Send a private message to Sovarius Click to send Sovarius an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Sovarius's Trade Auction or SaleView Sovarius's Trade Auction or Sale
So i suppose i'm a little late.... But do you actually declare attackers on a planeswalker? Could someone give me a quick explanation or where i fould the rules for this.
 
WestWycke
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posted May 21, 2011 03:17 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for WestWycke Click Here to Email WestWycke Send a private message to WestWycke Click to send WestWycke an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Comprehensive Rules
508.1a The active player chooses which creatures that he or she controls, if any, will attack. The chosen creatures must be untapped, and each one must either have haste or have been controlled by the active player continuously since the turn began.

508.1b If the defending player controls any planeswalkers, or the game allows the active player to attack multiple other players, the active player announces which player or planeswalker each of the chosen creatures is attacking.

Whenever a player attacks, he must declare which personage each creature is attacking. Once declared, that creature will only be able to deal combat damage to that personage or any blockers who intercede.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by WestWycke on May 21, 2011]

 
TomB999
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posted May 22, 2011 06:20 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for TomB999 Click Here to Email TomB999 Send a private message to TomB999 Click to send TomB999 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View TomB999's Have/Want ListView TomB999's Have/Want List
The card Standstill has the text "If you do", so do you have to sacrifice standstill when a spell is cast or do you have the choice to do so?
 
thror
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posted May 22, 2011 06:50 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by TomB999:
The card Standstill has the text "If you do", so do you have to sacrifice standstill when a spell is cast or do you have the choice to do so?

When a spell is cast, standstill triggers, and when that trigger resolves you have to sac it. It has the 'if you do' text so that you wont draw 3 unless it is actually sacrificed, preventing you from drawing 3 multiple times if 2 or more spells are cast in response to standstill.

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JoshSherman
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posted May 22, 2011 08:16 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for JoshSherman Click Here to Email JoshSherman Send a private message to JoshSherman Click to send JoshSherman an Instant MessageVisit JoshSherman's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View JoshSherman's Trade Auction or SaleView JoshSherman's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by thror:
When a spell is cast, standstill triggers, and when that trigger resolves you have to sac it. It has the 'if you do' text so that you wont draw 3 unless it is actually sacrificed, preventing you from drawing 3 multiple times if 2 or more spells are cast in response to standstill.


Could it also be destroyed in response to the trigger to prevent the card draw?

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thror
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posted May 22, 2011 08:21 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by JoshSherman:
Could it also be destroyed in response to the trigger to prevent the card draw?


Not really. It would (probably) just trigger again. The only way to remove a standstill without someone drawing cards is with a permanent already on the battlefield (seal of cleansing would work)

Edit: Stifle doesnt work either, because it also just triggers again.

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[Edited 2 times, lastly by thror on May 22, 2011]

 

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