So, yeah. I hope it gets the axe. I don't know that it's a good idea to insta-ban cards, however. But ASAP would be nice. The alternative is to ban enablers like Brainstorm and company, and IMO that makes for a much, much worse format. If it's not insta-banned, I hope that doesn't mean they'll ban the enablers instead.

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"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

I HIGHLY doubt wizards just printed this card and no one there was just like "man, this card sucks with brainstorm and jace around"

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Originally posted by coasterdude84:
I'm sure it's been heavily tested, but the very real possibility of Turn 1 Brainstorm, Turn 2 Time Walk does exist, and in fact should not be terribly hard to do. Furthermore, it becomes very easy to chain 2 of these together with a single EOT Brainstorm, and Surprise!, I'm now going to take 3 turns in a row. On face value, it just seems too good.

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If you are talking about Legacy, then you need to have 2 mana open as you draw the card to be able to cast it.

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MOTL Fantasy NBA 2010 Champion

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Originally posted by gcowhsu:
The card is like progenitus and natural order. I wouldn't run 4 maybe 1 or 2. You can't use it until turn 3 because you will only have one land on turn 2 unless you run green.

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Or artifact mana. Or Spirit-Guides.

I don't think anyone is really concerned about the early-game, where it's difficult to make it relevant unless you're running some sort of combo. Rather, the concern is for mid-game lockouts.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

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Originally posted by simbayu:
It's a natural fit in legacy rug delver. Chaining time walks is going to be crazy.

Although you can't upkeep brainstorm to stack your draw which makes it a little more awkward.

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Originally posted by junichi:
If you are talking about Legacy, then you need to have 2 mana open as you draw the card to be able to cast it.

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You're right, so more likely turns 2 and 3, but I still believe it to be a little too good.

EDIT:

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Originally posted by JackSpade:
The different borders makes me think that the miracle cards will have some sort of restriction, for example only one per deck or something to that effect. Otherwise Temporal Mastery is ridiculous.

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quote:

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Originally posted by stu55:
I love spoiler season cause you get to see everyone over-react to every spoiling.

I HIGHLY doubt wizards just printed this card and no one there was just like "man, this card sucks with brainstorm and jace around"

Willing to bet card isn't as good as people are claiming it to be.

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I partially agree with what you said here. No doubt, the card is strong, but I think it looks stronger than it actually is. Will it still get restricted in Vintage and banned in Legacy? Probably, but I don't have high hopes that WoTC will instant ban/restrict it right away until it is proven to be a problematic card for the formats.

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MOTL Fantasy NBA 2010 Champion

quote:

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Originally posted by stu55:
I love spoiler season cause you get to see everyone over-react to every spoiling.

I HIGHLY doubt wizards just printed this card and no one there was just like "man, this card sucks with brainstorm and jace around"

Willing to bet card isn't as good as people are claiming it to be.

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Originally posted by AlmostGrown:

Exactly, people act like Force of Will, Daze, Pyroblast and any number of 2 mana counter spells dont exist.

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On the other hand, those cards are all available to the person casting it too. Not to mention that if your strategy against a deck consists in "draw counterspell at the right time", then you don't actually have a strategy, and that lack of strategy gets more and more obvious the more must-counter spells that deck contains.

I think the point is that if Time Walk is too broken for Legacy, and this is not actually a real step down from Time Walk given the existing card pool, then it seems to follow that this is too broken for Legacy.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

quote:

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Originally posted by Goaswerfraiejen:

On the other hand, those cards are all available to the person casting it too. Not to mention that if your strategy against a deck consists in "draw counterspell at the right time", then you don't actually have a strategy, and that lack of strategy gets more and more obvious the more must-counter spells that deck contains.

I think the point is that if Time Walk is too broken for Legacy, and this is not actually a real step down from Time Walk given the existing card pool, then it seems to follow that this is too broken for Legacy.

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Thing is timewalk doesn't get removed from the game when you cast it which prevents silly thing happening with Ewitness and Brainstorm.

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Originally posted by WeedIan:
Thing is timewalk doesn't get removed from the game when you cast it which prevents silly thing happening with Ewitness and Brainstorm.

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If a few months go by and we find out I'm wrong, you can all make fun of me. I'll be getting at least a playset.

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Originally posted by coasterdude84:

No, it's probably just like the color shifted or Eldrazi or even the little tombstone on old flashback cards. Just something different to do. If there were any restrictions, they'd have put it on the card somewhere.

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That's not necessarily true. Planeswalkers aren't legendary but are...

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Originally posted by hilikuS:
That's not necessarily true. Planeswalkers aren't legendary but are...

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I give it 30 seconds.

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Originally posted by Devonin:
How long into the prerelease before the first argument and judge call around someone drawing a card, putting it in their hand, and then saying "Playing this for its miracle cost"?

I give it 30 seconds.

Nothing on the card says you need to -reveal- it as it is being drawn, simply that it needs to be the first card you drew that turn, and played while in your draw step before you announce going into first main phase. It's going to get very messy considering almost -every- competitive magic player's obsession with quickly riffling all the cards in their hand.

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There won't be any argument, if it's in your hand mixed with any other card, you missed the trigger, end of story.

Same as with Delver, if you draw it, to late to try and reveal it.

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Originally posted by WeedIan:
Thing is timewalk doesn't get removed from the game when you cast it which prevents silly thing happening with Ewitness and Brainstorm.

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It doesn't prevent anything with Brainstorm, and it's only removed after successful casting, so a Witness or Noxious Revival could still grab it. In any case, I don't think the concern with it is for an infinite turn combo or long chains of turns (although given a decent hand and board state, two might be feasible), but rather for cheap extra turns (i.e. it's really, really easy to set up the Miracle Cost consistently without really changing anything in most blue decks).

But we'll see. I definitely think it should be banned, but I also think it should have some time to prove itself first.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari

quote:

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Originally posted by Devonin:
Nothing on the card says you need to -reveal- it as it is being drawn, simply that it needs to be the first card you drew that turn, and played while in your draw step before you announce going into first main phase. It's going to get very messy considering almost -every- competitive magic player's obsession with quickly riffling all the cards in their hand.

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I just realized that you can actually cast it during your opponent's turn, what with SDT, BS, and company. I guess the potential benefit hinges on WOTC's interpretation of "extra turn after this one"). If that works, then that makes it much more interesting to play with.

__________________
"I have heard the mermaids singing, each to each. I do not think they will sing to me." -T.S. Eliot

RIP Ari