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Originally posted by aethertech:
WotC is trying to kill legacy and vintage even harder than before.
TO THE PITCHFORKS! AND BRING THE TORCHES!

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Do proxies really encourage more players to play though? Proxy events have less players than normal events so you cannot say "barrier to entry" is the problem.

IMHO, I don't think most players even care about playing older formats. Keep in mind that today, new players outnumber veteran players by a large margin. Not in age but years played.

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Originally posted by choco man:
Do proxies really encourage more players to play though? Proxy events have less players than normal events so you cannot say "barrier to entry" is the problem.

IMHO, I don't think most players even care about playing older formats. Keep in mind that today, new players outnumber veteran players by a large margin. Not in age but years played.

Most new players prefer modern to legacy and hate even the idea of vintage. New players don't even enjoy cube. They just completely lack the context of playing a masticore on turn four because:
A. Upkeep costs are all "bad"
B. The wow factor of 4cc 4/4 being good is a foreign concept to new players who have always had siege rhino
C. They have never used the card in the context in which it was designed for (circa 2000 type2, where control decks or creature less decks were common)

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Where did proxies jump into this?

Also, I've played since 1995 and I can tell you that I absolutely hate Vintage. Always have. Legacy sort of had the same stigma to me until I watched a local Legacy tournament. I'd say Legacy is not only fair. It actually feels like fun. It just requires a bit of knowledge about certain archetypes.

I enjoyed EDH and cube until it devolved into "how many combos can you pack in a deck?" What was once casual and fun is now just Vintage in new forms. This includes Tiny Leaders.

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Since I got a free cube draft on mtgo, I figured why not. It wasn't exactly what I expected. Had a really solid red blue deck with 5 big planeswalkers (jtms, Chandra, Koth, dack & baby jace). Ended up getting show an telled an emakeral both games round 1 and sneak attacked progenitus the 2nd game both times. Was not exactly too interactive for me.

I (have) still 4 TL decks assembled with the cards I planned on keeping to sit on out of ideas I had. Was a blast to play till you realize if you're not playing ezuri elves or Geist pillow fort, no matter how strong your deck is, it's not exactly gonna overcome those.

Stores can't run unsanctioned proxy events and keep WPN status. Stores without WPN status can't get FNM promos, prerelease product, and the like.

Stores can allow un-paid play involving proxies.

https://twitter.com/helenebergeot/status/687072898545102848

https://www.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/40kdsz/wizards_may_be_cracking_down_on_unsanctioned/cyvzi9d

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Originally posted by Pail42:
[B]WotC update on the whole ban-whammie following the Kozilek spoiler. Clarifies policy without actually spelling out the policy, but it's the best we've got to work with.

http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/learning-opportunities-2016-01-13[/ B]

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**** like this makes me wanna sell out.

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So, their Gestapo will crack down on stores where players are using proxies...but then they won't reprint cards that people want to play with so that they're actually available, rather than being held for ransom from SCG, CFB, and the hordes of a-holes who slab old cards. They want to throw money down the drain chasing after Chinese counterfeiters, but then won't print product that has those greatly desired cards so that they can make truckloads of money.

Did someone send Mark Rosewater a picture of his kids taken through a snipers scope or something?

quote:

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Originally posted by aethertech:
WotC is trying to kill legacy and vintage even harder than before.
TO THE PITCHFORKS! AND BRING THE TORCHES!

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This is why I posted about Proxies. But really, I just think that the internet tends to over-exaggerate everything.

I mean when Legacy got it's boost, cards were easy to find and they are still easy to find, just more expensive. There is no scarcity at all.

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Originally posted by chaos021:
Where did proxies jump into this?

Also, I've played since 1995 and I can tell you that I absolutely hate Vintage. Always have. Legacy sort of had the same stigma to me until I watched a local Legacy tournament. I'd say Legacy is not only fair. It actually feels like fun. It just requires a bit of knowledge about certain archetypes.

I enjoyed EDH and cube until it devolved into "how many combos can you pack in a deck?" What was once casual and fun is now just Vintage in new forms. This includes Tiny Leaders.

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I really do believe that Legacy is the best format for MTG. It consistently produces the good games and there are decks avaialbe for all kinds of players. Prison/lock decks which aren't available other than in Vintage, Aggro, Control, Mid-Range, Combo....

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Originally posted by choco man:
This is why I posted about Proxies. But really, I just think that the internet tends to over-exaggerate everything.

I mean when Legacy got it's boost, cards were easy to find and they are still easy to find, just more expensive. There is no scarcity at all.

I really do believe that Legacy is the best format for MTG. It consistently produces the good games and there are decks avaialbe for all kinds of players. Prison/lock decks which aren't available other than in Vintage, Aggro, Control, Mid-Range, Combo....

Of course you had a horrible time playing Vintage Cube. It's a poorly designed format. The cube list was horrible. Any kind of format that a incentivizes taking a random signet over a lightning bolt is doomed to fail.

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Speaking of cube.

LSV doesn't know when to 'Geddon....

Now back, to your irregularly scheduled program of people arguing about what is best for MTG as a game.

STANDARD IS CANCER.

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Originally posted by aethertech:

STANDARD IS CANCER.

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Originally posted by choco man:
I really do believe that Legacy is the best format for MTG. It consistently produces the good games and there are decks avaialbe for all kinds of players. Prison/lock decks which aren't available other than in Vintage, Aggro, Control, Mid-Range, Combo....

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There is no reason to play anything else BUT Legacy .

I loathe Standard. To costly and to time consuming. Never got into Modern, but I still might. Vintage has become WAY too narrow and inaccessible over here (mainly due to the absence of tournaments). Legacy is an open format for me. Even rogue decks still have a shot at surprising at a tourney, even after such a long time.

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Originally posted by AEther Storm:
There is no reason to play anything else BUT Legacy .

I loathe Standard. To costly and to time consuming. Never got into Modern, but I still might. Vintage has become WAY too narrow and inaccessible over here (mainly due to the absence of tournaments). Legacy is an open format for me. Even rogue decks still have a shot at surprising at a tourney, even after such a long time.

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Originally posted by Vegas10:
I too enjoy legacy, but do give Modern a try it is a diverse format as well and quite different from legacy, it def has more linear decks than legacy but there are many styles it accomadtes, though both lack much control nowadays. And yeah I havn't played hardly any standard in 2 years once I heard they were doing 6 month rotations just too much to keep up with always changing decks for someone with kids who can't play a ton.

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Originally posted by DJSmurfy:
If I had the skills and tools, I'd make a video of snippets of these statements from WotC set to the Benny Hill theme.

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Does anyone really play Standard anymore?
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__________________
"Message to women worldwide: Girls....we're stupid. We don't like games. We don't know games. We can't read minds. Say it like you mean or STFU." -rockondon

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Originally posted by flavor_of_the_weak:

Does anyone really play Standard anymore?

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Originally posted by LandDestroyer:
I've heard of people wanting to sell out of modern and buy into modern since they keep banning entire decks in modern

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