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Author Topic:   Rulings Thread Part 46 (ALL rules-related questions go HERE!)
Meddling Pimp
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posted October 25, 2010 06:45 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Meddling Pimp Click Here to Email Meddling Pimp Send a private message to Meddling Pimp Click to send Meddling Pimp an Instant MessageVisit Meddling Pimp's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by stacker:
two replacements are trying to affect the same thing

the affected player (you) get to decide the order

once one applies, there is nothing for the other to replace


That said, if choosing one replacement effect creates a loop and there is another option that does not, you must ultimately choose the other option. (Wheel of Sun and Moon will not save you from leyline/helm of obedience)

 
Lloyder
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posted October 26, 2010 02:31 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Lloyder Click Here to Email Lloyder Send a private message to Lloyder Click to send Lloyder an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
This question came up at our local shop this weekend.

Player A has a Tumble Magnet in play and some creatures. He all out attacks.

Player B takes the damage, on his next turn he casts a Sunblast Angel to destroy all player A's creatures.

Can player A tap the angel before the come into play effect happens using his Tumble Magnet?

Thank you in advance for the help.

 
Meddling Pimp
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posted October 26, 2010 05:51 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Meddling Pimp Click Here to Email Meddling Pimp Send a private message to Meddling Pimp Click to send Meddling Pimp an Instant MessageVisit Meddling Pimp's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Lloyder:
This question came up at our local shop this weekend.

Player A has a Tumble Magnet in play and some creatures. He all out attacks.

Player B takes the damage, on his next turn he casts a Sunblast Angel to destroy all player A's creatures.

Can player A tap the angel before the come into play effect happens using his Tumble Magnet?

Thank you in advance for the help.


Yes. The ETB ability is a trigger which goes on the stack once the angel hits the board. With the trigger on the stack, Player A could tap it with the magnet.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by Meddling Pimp on October 26, 2010]

 
Lloyder
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posted October 26, 2010 04:46 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Lloyder Click Here to Email Lloyder Send a private message to Lloyder Click to send Lloyder an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Thank you muchly!
 
mulder
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posted October 26, 2010 08:20 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for mulder Click Here to Email mulder Send a private message to mulder Click to send mulder an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
If I reveal Gush with a Mind's Desire, can I still play the Gush for its alternative cost?
 
keywacat
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posted October 27, 2010 12:26 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for keywacat Click Here to Email keywacat Send a private message to keywacat Click to send keywacat an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View keywacat's Have/Want ListView keywacat's Have/Want List
Can I feed a Warren Instigator to a Clickslither between the first strike and normal combat steps? That is hit the opponent with Instigator, drop a goblin and feed both to Clickslither, who then crashes into my opponent pour beaucoup de d�g�ts.

Cheers for the answer!
~keywacat

[Edited 1 times, lastly by keywacat on October 27, 2010]

 
Meddling Pimp
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posted October 27, 2010 06:10 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Meddling Pimp Click Here to Email Meddling Pimp Send a private message to Meddling Pimp Click to send Meddling Pimp an Instant MessageVisit Meddling Pimp's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by keywacat:
Can I feed a Warren Instigator to a Clickslither between the first strike and normal combat steps? That is hit the opponent with Instigator, drop a goblin and feed both to Clickslither, who then crashes into my opponent pour beaucoup de dégâts.

Cheers for the answer!
~keywacat


Absolutely. Each player gets priority in each damage step (after damage has been dealt).



[Edited 1 times, lastly by Meddling Pimp on October 27, 2010]

 
orcishartillery
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posted October 27, 2010 10:11 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for orcishartillery Send a private message to orcishartillery Click to send orcishartillery an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by mulder:
If I reveal Gush with a Mind's Desire, can I still play the Gush for its alternative cost?

No, you can not. Mind's Desire allows you to play the card from exile for an alternative cost (i.e. "without paying its mana cost"). You can't apply two alternative costs to the same spell.

117.9. Some spells have alternative costs. An alternative cost is a cost listed in a spell's text, or applied to it from another effect, that its controller may pay rather than paying the spell's mana cost. Alternative costs are usually phrased, "You may [action] rather than pay [this object's] mana cost," or "You may cast [this object] without paying its mana cost." Note that some alternative costs are listed in keywords; see rule 702.

117.9a Only one alternative cost can be applied to any one spell as it's being cast. The controller of the spell announces his or her intentions to pay that cost as described in rule 601.2b.

 
DeMoNiC DuNcE
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posted October 27, 2010 12:16 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for DeMoNiC DuNcE Click Here to Email DeMoNiC DuNcE Send a private message to DeMoNiC DuNcE Click to send DeMoNiC DuNcE an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
My friend insisted I get more information for him to comprehend the combat phase.

If I declare a creature a blocker, and before damage step I remove it from combat (by a source such as fling), does the attacking creature deal any combat damage since it's been blocked?

 
thror
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posted October 27, 2010 12:54 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by DeMoNiC DuNcE:
My friend insisted I get more information for him to comprehend the combat phase.

If I declare a creature a blocker, and before damage step I remove it from combat (by a source such as fling), does the attacking creature deal any combat damage since it's been blocked?


Once blocked, it stays blocked until the end of combat, unless something else says otherwise. It can now only deal damage to a player if it has trample.

__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

 
Myy
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posted October 27, 2010 01:01 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Myy Click Here to Email Myy Send a private message to Myy Click to send Myy an Instant MessageVisit Myy's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Myy's Have/Want ListView Myy's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by orcishartillery:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by mulder:
If I reveal Gush with a Mind's Desire, can I still play the Gush for its alternative cost?

No, you can not. Mind's Desire allows you to play the card from exile for an alternative cost (i.e. "without paying its mana cost"). You can't apply two alternative costs to the same spell.

117.9. Some spells have alternative costs. An alternative cost is a cost listed in a spell's text, or applied to it from another effect, that its controller may pay rather than paying the spell's mana cost. Alternative costs are usually phrased, "You may [action] rather than pay [this object's] mana cost," or "You may cast [this object] without paying its mana cost." Note that some alternative costs are listed in keywords; see rule 702.

117.9a Only one alternative cost can be applied to any one spell as it's being cast. The controller of the spell announces his or her intentions to pay that cost as described in rule 601.2b.[/QUOTE]

what if there's a Fist of Suns in play, can he play it by spending one of each mana?

Or what if the FoS is in play, and a Gush in hand. can he decide which way to pay for it? if to pay WUBRG or return 2 islands?

 
DeMoNiC DuNcE
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posted October 27, 2010 01:19 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for DeMoNiC DuNcE Click Here to Email DeMoNiC DuNcE Send a private message to DeMoNiC DuNcE Click to send DeMoNiC DuNcE an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by thror:
Once blocked, it stays blocked until the end of combat, unless something else says otherwise. It can now only deal damage to a player if it has trample.



So following this up, if the creature that blocks is flinged, but the creature that attacked had trample, does it deal its full damage to the player or the last checked toughness of the blocking creature before assigning player damage?

 
OGB
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posted October 27, 2010 01:22 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for OGB Click Here to Email OGB Send a private message to OGB Click to send OGB an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by DeMoNiC DuNcE:
So following this up, if the creature that blocks is flinged, but the creature that attacked had trample, does it deal its full damage to the player or the last checked toughness of the blocking creature before assigning player damage?


It will deal full damage to the player.

 
orcishartillery
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posted October 28, 2010 10:22 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for orcishartillery Send a private message to orcishartillery Click to send orcishartillery an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Myy:
what if there's a Fist of Suns in play, can he play it by spending one of each mana?

If he has revealed the Gush with Mind's Desire, the only way he can play it is via the effect from Mind's Desire, which specifies an alternative cost. He can't play it from exile via Mind's Desire while choosing a different alternative cost.

quote:
Or what if the FoS is in play, and a Gush in hand. can he decide which way to pay for it? if to pay WUBRG or return 2 islands?
In that case, he can choose to pay either of the alternative costs as he plays the Gush.
 
AlmostGrown
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posted October 30, 2010 07:34 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for AlmostGrown Click Here to Email AlmostGrown Send a private message to AlmostGrown Click to send AlmostGrown an Instant MessageVisit AlmostGrown's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View AlmostGrown's Have/Want ListView AlmostGrown's Have/Want List
I archive trap my opponent, and of the 13 cards he reveals, one is Emrakul, the Aeons Torn. The way he mills himself is putting the top card of his library into the graveyard one by one. The 2nd card he reveals was Emrakul, and he picks up his graveyard to shuffle into his library. I tell him to stop, and that he has to finish with the other cards because a triggered ability can't trigger while another ability is still resolving.

Am I correct in saying this?

edit: spelling/grammar

[Edited 1 times, lastly by AlmostGrown on October 30, 2010]

 
JoshSherman
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posted October 30, 2010 10:16 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for JoshSherman Click Here to Email JoshSherman Send a private message to JoshSherman Click to send JoshSherman an Instant MessageVisit JoshSherman's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View JoshSherman's Trade Auction or SaleView JoshSherman's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by AlmostGrown:
I archive trap my opponent, and of the 13 cards he reveals, one is Emrakul, the Aeons Torn. The way he mills himself is putting the top card of his library into the graveyard one by one. The 2nd card he reveals was Emrakul, and he picks up his graveyard to shuffle into his library. I tell him to stop, and that he has to finish with the other cards because a triggered ability can't trigger while another ability is still resolving.

Am I correct in saying this?

edit: spelling/grammar


Absolutely. That's why you Ravenous trap them (or Archive again) with an Eldrazi ability on the stack.

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darius vitrosoo
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posted October 31, 2010 03:48 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for darius vitrosoo Click Here to Email darius vitrosoo Send a private message to darius vitrosoo Click to send darius vitrosoo an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
1.if i have a true conviction in play and my perilious myr dies and goes to the graveyard do i still gain life from his ability or does he lose lifelink by being dead?

2.can i put a skinrender ability on the stack, sac him to a culling dias and kill nothing?

3.with electropotence can i deal infect damage?

4. does clone (or creatures of the like) take the modified power/toughness of the creature or the beginning p/t? same question with abilitys.

 
caquaa
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posted October 31, 2010 06:24 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for caquaa Click Here to Email caquaa Send a private message to caquaa Click to send caquaa an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View caquaa's Trade Auction or SaleView caquaa's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by darius vitrosoo:
1.if i have a true conviction in play and my perilious myr dies and goes to the graveyard do i still gain life from his ability or does he lose lifelink by being dead?


The source of the damage had lifelink (last known information) so you will gain life


quote:
Originally posted by darius vitrosoo:

2.can i put a skinrender ability on the stack, sac him to a culling dias and kill nothing?


when he comes into play you must target a creature with his ability. You can target himself then sac him to the dias.

quote:
Originally posted by darius vitrosoo:

3.with electropotence can i deal infect damage?


if the creature has infect, you sure can.

quote:
Originally posted by darius vitrosoo:

4. does clone (or creatures of the like) take the modified power/toughness of the creature or the beginning p/t? same question with abilitys.


It makes a copy of whatever is printed on the card.
 
mattw
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posted November 01, 2010 08:12 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for mattw Click Here to Email mattw Send a private message to mattw Click to send mattw an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View mattw's Have/Want ListView mattw's Have/Want List
I can't remember the name of the card off-hand but it's:

X: Artifact creatures you control become X/X until end of turn.

My one friend wants to pay 0 to kill his own creatures and the other friend thinks X can't be zero. I'm sure X can be zero but he wants some kinda proof.

 
WestWycke
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posted November 01, 2010 08:29 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for WestWycke Click Here to Email WestWycke Send a private message to WestWycke Click to send WestWycke an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Mirror Entity is the closest card I can think of, although it affects all creatures you control, not just artifact creatures. For this rules discussion, it'll do.

First, from the rulings on Mirror Entity:
10/1/2007 Activating the ability with X = 0 will cause all creatures you control to become 0/0 and be put into the graveyard.

Next, Comp. Rules say: (Emphasis mine)
107.3. Many objects use the letter X as a placeholder for a number that needs to be determined. Some objects have abilities that define the value of X; the rest let their controller choose the value of X.

107.3a If a spell or activated ability has a mana cost, alternative cost, additional cost, and/or activation cost with an {X}, [-X], or X in it, and the value of X isn’t defined by the text of that spell or ability, the controller of that spell or ability chooses and announces the value of X as part of casting the spell or activating the ability. (See rule 601, “Casting Spells.”) While a spell is on the stack, any X in its mana cost equals the announced value. While an activated ability is on the stack, any X in its activation cost equals the announced value.

107.1. The only numbers the Magic game uses are integers.

107.1b Most of the time, the Magic game uses only positive numbers and zero. You can’t choose a negative number, deal negative damage, gain negative life, and so on. ...

So, rules 107.3/3a state that you can choose a number when activating the ability, and rules 107.1/1b state that the only numbers used are positive numbers and zero.

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mattw
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posted November 02, 2010 05:10 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for mattw Click Here to Email mattw Send a private message to mattw Click to send mattw an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View mattw's Have/Want ListView mattw's Have/Want List
thx a ton. And it is mirror entity. My friend has a reaper king edh deck and wanted to keep it from getting put on the bottom of his library so he wanted to kill it himself.
 
DeMoNiC DuNcE
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posted November 06, 2010 07:39 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for DeMoNiC DuNcE Click Here to Email DeMoNiC DuNcE Send a private message to DeMoNiC DuNcE Click to send DeMoNiC DuNcE an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
If I have a Greater Gargadon suspended, and I play Murderous Redcap, can I sacrifice the redcap to Gargadon and as persist activates, sacrifice it before the -1/-1 counter is placed by persist? Effectively creating a damage loop?
 
thror
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posted November 06, 2010 08:03 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by DeMoNiC DuNcE:
If I have a Greater Gargadon suspended, and I play Murderous Redcap, can I sacrifice the redcap to Gargadon and as persist activates, sacrifice it before the -1/-1 counter is placed by persist? Effectively creating a damage loop?

No. From the rules - 702.76a. Persist is a triggered ability. "Persist" means "When this permanent is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, if it had no -1/-1 counters on it, return it to the battlefield under its owner's control with a -1/-1 counter on it."

When the creature returns to the battlefield, it comes with a counter, there is no time to sacrifice it in response. Sorry.

__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

 
TimeBeing
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posted November 06, 2010 08:03 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for TimeBeing Click Here to Email TimeBeing Send a private message to TimeBeing Click to send TimeBeing an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by DeMoNiC DuNcE:
If I have a Greater Gargadon suspended, and I play Murderous Redcap, can I sacrifice the redcap to Gargadon and as persist activates, sacrifice it before the -1/-1 counter is placed by persist? Effectively creating a damage loop?

No it was the -1/-1 counter on it when it comes back into play.


502.79. Persist
502.79a Persist is a triggered ability. "Persist" means "When this permanent is put into a graveyard from play, if it had no -1/-1 counters on it, return it to play under its owner's control with a -1/-1 counter on it."


 
DeMoNiC DuNcE
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posted November 06, 2010 08:55 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for DeMoNiC DuNcE Click Here to Email DeMoNiC DuNcE Send a private message to DeMoNiC DuNcE Click to send DeMoNiC DuNcE an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Don't apologize. A friend was trying to pull this one on me and I was nearly sure it didn't work. Needed verification. Thanks.
 

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