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Author
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Topic: The Rulings and Questions Thread, part 50: Post ALL your Rules Questions Here
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thror
Member
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posted March 16, 2012 11:32 PM
       
quote:
Originally posted by Timmy!:
So I am wondering if this combo is legit because I lost two in a row to it.My opponent has a Leyline of the Void in play as well as a Helm of Obedience. He activates the Helm for only 1, but since Leyline reads that if cards would enter the GY they would become exiled instead. ((ergo never hitting the GY)) Helm reads to repeat the process of putting the top card into your GY until X is reached. Since one card never actually hits the GY, the Helm basically just instantly decks you. Is that REALLY possible? It doesn't make sense that two cards could make such a simple and super cheesy combo. If this really is the case, then I would like to figure out how to get this super cheese errataed so that a Helm for 1 is just that, a Helm for 1. How can I go about trying to get this proposed to be fixed?
It has worked like this for years. It isnt going to get changed. Deal with it, move on. Rulings from Gatherer about it (from 2008):
http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=184550 If an effect like that of Leyline of the Void prevents cards from being put into your opponent's graveyard, the process described in the first sentence of Helm of Obedience's effect will never stop. Your opponent's entire library will be exiled, even if X is 1. __________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted [19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself
[Edited 1 times, lastly by thror on March 16, 2012]
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Timmy!
Member
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posted March 17, 2012 01:32 AM
 
I thought the point of having an errata though is to prevent cards from being used in a way other than was intended. What you are trying to tell me is that wizards intended the Helm to work as an infinite mill. I just simply don't see how this makes sense. I understand that Wizards doesn't want to have to keep adding erratas to cards, but this card does date back to Alliances when having an errata wasn't that uncommon. Even if an opponent has no creatures in his deck ((and so long as cards can still enter the GY)) the helm still would have the limit of X cards requiring the player activating the Helm to dump all that mana to get X far. With the Leyline in play, though, it suddenly changes into "I win" for only 1 mana. I don't believe that Wizards had an intent like this in mind when the Helm was created. I understand that this is the current ruling ATM, so all I am wondering is where I can go to try and appeal this ruling. I don't think I can think of a cheesier way to lose a game compared to this one here other than losing to Chester Cheeto himself. =( There currently is no errata on the Helm, and I think this needs to change. Otherwise, you are telling me Wizards intended it to work as a 1 mana instant win. ((Which I highly doubt Wizards had in mind when they designed the Helm)) __________________
Help me Obi-Wan Kenobi...
...you're my only hope.
[Edited 2 times, lastly by Timmy! on March 17, 2012]
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Loathing
Member
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posted March 17, 2012 01:40 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Timmy!:
With the Leyline in play, though, it suddenly changes into "I win" for only 1 mana. I don't believe that Wizards had an intent like this in mind when the Helm was created. I understand that this is the current ruling ATM, so all I am wondering is where I can go to try and appeal this ruling. I don't think I can think of a cheesier way to win a game compared to this one here other than losing to Chester Cheeto himself. =(
Lol, except Helm costs 4 and so does Leyline if you don't draw it in your starting hand. But don't listen to me, call WotC customer support and get it changed, I'm sure they'll be happy to accommodate you. 
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Sovarius
Member
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posted March 17, 2012 02:00 AM
Wizards didn't plan the combo. What do you mean someone is telling you they intended it to be a 1 mana insta-win? Helm was out long before Leyline.
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Timmy!
Member
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posted March 17, 2012 02:22 AM
Exactly, they didn't plan the combo. Hence the need for an errata.And I'm talking 1 mana activation. Obviously you need a couple more mana to get the cards out.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by Timmy! on March 17, 2012]
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caquaa
Member
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posted March 17, 2012 03:49 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Timmy!:
waahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
think I covered your argument? players find creative ways to pair cards together, sometimes unintended. Cards are not errated for power level these days (there are exceptions that wotc refuses to acknowledge).
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Tha Gunslinga
Moderator
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posted March 17, 2012 05:08 AM
Wizards is not going to use errata to change either part of it.__________________
Looking for misprinted Commander decks. Got one? Talk to me.
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