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Author Topic:   The Rulings and Questions Thread, part 52: Post ALL your Rules Questions Here
helpmehelpyou
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posted October 08, 2012 01:39 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for helpmehelpyou Click Here to Email helpmehelpyou Send a private message to helpmehelpyou Click to send helpmehelpyou an Instant MessageVisit helpmehelpyou's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View helpmehelpyou's Have/Want ListView helpmehelpyou's Have/Want List
when does Epic Experiment go to the GY?

lets say I cast it for 6
I exile 6 and get to play 3 for "free"
does EE go to the GY befor or after the 3 cards are played?
or can I choose when to put EE in the GY??

 
Pail42
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posted October 08, 2012 03:17 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Pail42 Send a private message to Pail42 Click to send Pail42 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Pail42's Have/Want ListView Pail42's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by GenghisTom:
Ok,

Tidehollow Sculler enters the battlefield.
Trigger on the stack (when ETB, exile card)
I somehow bounce the Sculler back to my hand in response.
Leave play trigger on stack (leaves, return the card)

The leaves play trigger goes off first - essentially doing nothing. Then the ETB trigger resolves and I get to exile a card correct?


Yes.

quote:
Originally posted by helpmehelpyou:
when does Epic Experiment go to the GY?

lets say I cast it for 6
I exile 6 and get to play 3 for "free"
does EE go to the GY befor or after the 3 cards are played?
or can I choose when to put EE in the GY??


Spells are put into the graveyard after they are done resolving.

First the spells you didn't play are put in the graveyard as part of EE's text. Then Epic Experiment is put in the graveyard, then the spells you played for free are put into the graveyard. At the time Epic Experiment is finished resolving the spells you cast for free are all waiting on the stack.

 
orcishartillery
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posted October 09, 2012 09:58 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for orcishartillery Send a private message to orcishartillery Click to send orcishartillery an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by ardeay:
New Rule Question!

My Scavenging Ooze targets a creature card in an opponents graveyard, I hold priority, then play surgical extraction on that same creature card in response.

Is the +1 counter and 1 life still rewarded


No. Scavenging Ooze's ability is countered because it no longer has a legal target.


 
harbingerofthevoid
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posted October 10, 2012 05:46 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for harbingerofthevoid Click Here to Email harbingerofthevoid Send a private message to harbingerofthevoid Click to send harbingerofthevoid an Instant MessageVisit harbingerofthevoid's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View harbingerofthevoid's Have/Want ListView harbingerofthevoid's Have/Want List
If I cast Burn Trail and have 4 red creatures in play, can I Conspire twice?
 
thror
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posted October 10, 2012 10:18 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by harbingerofthevoid:
If I cast Burn Trail and have 4 red creatures in play, can I Conspire twice?

No. Conspire is an additional cost you may pay to get that effect. Think of it as 'Kicker - tap 2 red creatures, copy this'. You can only pay it once.

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[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
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ryan2754
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posted October 12, 2012 11:51 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for ryan2754 Click Here to Email ryan2754 Send a private message to ryan2754 Click to send ryan2754 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View ryan2754's Have/Want ListView ryan2754's Have/Want List
How do the Medallions from Tempest interact with X costing spells.

For example, if I have a Sapphire Medallion and Ruby Medallion in play, and cast Epic Experiment, do I get X=2 for 'free' for just paying the Red and Blue in the EE mana cost?

 
Pail42
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posted October 12, 2012 12:13 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Pail42 Send a private message to Pail42 Click to send Pail42 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Pail42's Have/Want ListView Pail42's Have/Want List
Medallions affect the mana cost you need to pay to cast the spell. The spell's converted mana cost (which is what epic experiment cares about) is unchanged. Medallions do not help Epic Experiment.

As far as I'm aware, there isn't anything that exists in the game that is capable of altering the converted mana cost of a spell.

 
thror
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posted October 12, 2012 08:36 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by ryan2754:
How do the Medallions from Tempest interact with X costing spells.

For example, if I have a Sapphire Medallion and Ruby Medallion in play, and cast Epic Experiment, do I get X=2 for 'free' for just paying the Red and Blue in the EE mana cost?


ignore what pali said. When you cast Epic Experiment, you first choose a value for X. Lets go with x=7 in this case. So the Cost of this epic experiment is now 7UR. when you go to PAY that cost, the game applies the sapp and ruby medallion, and says 'ok, this blue and red spell costs 2 less, please pay 5UR'.


So if you just want an Experiment where X=2, it would only cost you UR, but on the stack, it would still behave as a 2UR costed spell (couldnt be spell snared, for example)
__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

[19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself


[Edited 1 times, lastly by thror on October 12, 2012]

 
Pail42
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posted October 13, 2012 08:03 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Pail42 Send a private message to Pail42 Click to send Pail42 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Pail42's Have/Want ListView Pail42's Have/Want List
Thror is right. Medallions will allow you to play epic experiment for cheaper.

Somehow forgot that it had an X in the cost (facepalm).

All that jazz I wrote applies to what happens when the experiment is resolving. While it is correct it was not the original question.

 
Shron Von Drago
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posted October 14, 2012 10:51 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Shron Von Drago Click Here to Email Shron Von Drago Send a private message to Shron Von Drago Click to send Shron Von Drago an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I have a question about shuffling. I shuffle my deck and present it to my opponent and he shuffles it lets say i'm not satisfied with how he shuffled or suspect he may have shuffled a certain way on purpose what are my options can I shuffle again or have a judge shuffle it?

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thror
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posted October 14, 2012 11:10 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by Shron Von Drago:
I have a question about shuffling. I shuffle my deck and present it to my opponent and he shuffles it lets say i'm not satisfied with how he shuffled or suspect he may have shuffled a certain way on purpose what are my options can I shuffle again or have a judge shuffle it?


your only option is to call a judge and explain what you think happened. Step away from the table and talk to them. You cannot shuffle it after your opp shuffles, and judges are not there to shuffle decks.

__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

[19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself

 
tragicmagic
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posted October 14, 2012 11:46 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for tragicmagic Click Here to Email tragicmagic Send a private message to tragicmagic Click to send tragicmagic an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View tragicmagic's Trade Auction or SaleView tragicmagic's Trade Auction or Sale
If I attack with Geist of Saint Traft, and a player blocks with a 2/2, in response to the block, can I cast Rootborn Defenses, and populate the 4/4 token that was also attacking? I know it wouldn't be attacking technically, however, my Geist would survive, and the 4/4 that I populated wouldn't exile, yes?
 
thror
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posted October 14, 2012 12:37 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by tragicmagic:
If I attack with Geist of Saint Traft, and a player blocks with a 2/2, in response to the block, can I cast Rootborn Defenses, and populate the 4/4 token that was also attacking? I know it wouldn't be attacking technically, however, my Geist would survive, and the 4/4 that I populated wouldn't exile, yes?

Nitpick - you dont respond to blocks. Each player gets priority after blockers are declared, before damage is dealt.

That said, you are correct. Geist becomes indestructible (along with all your other creatures) and the new angel token does not get exiled.

__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

[19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself

 
stinkinogre
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posted October 14, 2012 12:41 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for stinkinogre Click Here to Email stinkinogre Send a private message to stinkinogre Click to send stinkinogre an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View stinkinogre's Have/Want ListView stinkinogre's Have/Want List
Sorry if this has already been asked. I'm to lazy to look at all the posts...anyhow

I have deathrite Shaman out. They play mulch binning an unburial rites. They have priority to play the rites before I can remove it?

 
thror
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posted October 14, 2012 12:56 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by stinkinogre:
Sorry if this has already been asked. I'm to lazy to look at all the posts...anyhow

I have deathrite Shaman out. They play mulch binning an unburial rites. They have priority to play the rites before I can remove it?


This is correct. Your opp is the active player (player whos turn it is). Whenever any spell or ability resolves, the active player is always the person to get priority first. So, his mulch resolves, bins unburial. He gets priority, and can cast that now.

IF he had somehow cast mulch on YOUR turn (quicken, had hypersonic dragon in play), YOU would get priority first, and would be able to deathrite it away.

__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

[19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself

 
Drexus
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posted October 14, 2012 01:10 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Drexus Click Here to Email Drexus Send a private message to Drexus Click to send Drexus an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
^ an add on to the previous question, does the active player not have to specify specifically he/she is keeping priority now though?

i.e. if they just cast mulch without saying he is keeping priority then you would have a chance to remove it.

 
thror
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posted October 14, 2012 01:25 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by Drexus:
^ an add on to the previous question, does the active player not have to specify specifically he/she is keeping priority now though?

i.e. if they just cast mulch without saying he is keeping priority then you would have a chance to remove it.


No. That is only to put multiple spells/abilities on the stack at once. Example - Cast lightning bolt, hold priority, cast reverberate, targeting lightning bolt.

As i said in the previous post, whenever ANYTHING resolves, the active player gets priority. You will only get priority if they pass it to you. It is a harder concept to grasp while playing paper magic, i suggest trying out the free mtgo decks to get a better feel for priority and the stack.

__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

[19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself


[Edited 1 times, lastly by thror on October 14, 2012]

 
stinkinogre
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posted October 14, 2012 01:29 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for stinkinogre Click Here to Email stinkinogre Send a private message to stinkinogre Click to send stinkinogre an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View stinkinogre's Have/Want ListView stinkinogre's Have/Want List
Drexus I've always just assumed they have priority till they go to cast another spell, activate an ability or switch phases but I'm a bad player so I dunno.

Thror I have one more question. Dredge and sylvan library makes my head hurt. So I have 3 dredge cards binned and activate my library how many cards can I dredge and do I pay the life if I dredge more than one.

Thanks

 
thror
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posted October 14, 2012 01:51 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by stinkinogre:
Drexus I've always just assumed they have priority till they go to cast another spell, activate an ability or switch phases but I'm a bad player so I dunno.

Thror I have one more question. Dredge and sylvan library makes my head hurt. So I have 3 dredge cards binned and activate my library how many cards can I dredge and do I pay the life if I dredge more than one.

Thanks


The first part of this is a good starting point on priority.

Sylvan + dredge is a bit tricky. So, you get 1 card from your draw step, and choose to dredge. Then you choose to 'draw 2' with sylvan, and replace both of these with dredge. This is the ruling from gatherer:

If you choose to draw two cards, then replace one or more of those draws with some other effect, the rest of Sylvan Library's ability still happens. If you've actually drawn only one card that turn, you must choose that card and either pay 4 life or put it on top of your library. If you haven't actually drawn any cards that turn, the rest of the ability has no effect.

End result, you get 2 free dredges. However, if you went 'dredge for turn, draw 1 with sylvan, dredge 1 with sylvan' you would have to pay4 life or put the drawn card back. Any order of '2 dredges+1draw' would result in 'pay4 or put drawn card back, and any order of '2draw+1dredge' is 'pay4 or put back' for each drawn card.

__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

[19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself


[Edited 1 times, lastly by thror on October 14, 2012]

 
oneofchaos
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posted October 14, 2012 03:15 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for oneofchaos Click Here to Email oneofchaos Send a private message to oneofchaos Click to send oneofchaos an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by thror:
This is correct. Your opp is the active player (player whos turn it is). Whenever any spell or ability resolves, the active player is always the person to get priority first. So, his mulch resolves, bins unburial. He gets priority, and can cast that now.

IF he had somehow cast mulch on YOUR turn (quicken, had hypersonic dragon in play), YOU would get priority first, and would be able to deathrite it away.


Can't you deathrite the card that it targets anyways in response to unburial rites?

 
thror
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posted October 14, 2012 03:35 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by oneofchaos:
Can't you deathrite the card that it targets anyways in response to unburial rites?

oh sure that works. but that wasnt the original question. :P
For whatever reason, he might not have the green mana to remove a creature, but has the black mana to remove unburial rights.
__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

[19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself


[Edited 1 times, lastly by thror on October 14, 2012]

 
MeddlingMage
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posted October 14, 2012 03:46 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for MeddlingMage Click Here to Email MeddlingMage Send a private message to MeddlingMage Click to send MeddlingMage an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View MeddlingMage's Have/Want ListView MeddlingMage's Have/Want List
This may be a stupid question but it came up so here goes.

Say I have a 3/3 Centaur Token in play with a +1/+1 counter on it from Common Bond. When I populate the token it doesn't make a 4/4, it makes a 3/3 right?

~MM

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thror
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posted October 14, 2012 03:55 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for thror Send a private message to thror Click to send thror an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View thror's Trade Auction or SaleView thror's Trade Auction or Sale
quote:
Originally posted by MeddlingMage:
This may be a stupid question but it came up so here goes.

Say I have a 3/3 Centaur Token in play with a +1/+1 counter on it from Common Bond. When I populate the token it doesn't make a 4/4, it makes a 3/3 right?

~MM


Correct. Any time anything gets copied, only the base/printed card gets copied. Any counters, status changes, etc, are not copied.

__________________
"He fights you not because you have wronged him, but because you are there."

[16:17] <@BrassMan> what do you need new tech for?
[16:18] <@BrassMan> gush is unrestricted

[19:01] <nderEvo> you can delete yourself

 
GenghisTom
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posted October 16, 2012 10:33 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for GenghisTom Click Here to Email GenghisTom Send a private message to GenghisTom Click to send GenghisTom an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Okay, so opponent has in play Lord of Atlantis and Phantasmal Image (copying Lord of Atlantis).

I cast Detention Sphere.
There are two targets I can choose from, LoA or PI.
If I target PI, it's sacrificed as a triggered effect.
Then, because the target is no longer there does Dentention Sphere's triggered ability fizzle? Therefore NOT also exiling LoA? (The PI has the same name as LoA because it's a copy correct?)

On the other hand, if I target LoA with Detention Sphere, PI would also be exiled correct? But NOT sacrificed because it wasn't a target in this case.
Meaning, if Detention Sphere leaves play, the Phantasmal Image will return to play with the Lord of Atlantis.

 
orcishartillery
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posted October 16, 2012 12:33 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for orcishartillery Send a private message to orcishartillery Click to send orcishartillery an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by thror:
your only option is to call a judge and explain what you think happened. Step away from the table and talk to them. You cannot shuffle it after your opp shuffles, and judges are not there to shuffle decks.

You can actually ask a judge to shuffle rather than your opponent. It's at the judge disrection whether or not to honor the request.

Here's the relevant excerpt from the Magic the Gathering Tournament Rules:

3.9 Card Shuffling

...

Once the deck is randomized, it must be presented to an opponent. By this action, players state that their decks are legal and randomized. The opponent may then shuffle it additionally. Cards and sleeves must not be in danger of being damaged during this process. If the opponent does not believe the player made a reasonable effort to randomize his or her deck, the opponent must notify a judge. Players may request to have a judge shuffle their cards rather than the opponent; this request will be honored only at a judge’s discretion.

...

 

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