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Author Topic:   Post for Commander/Edh Part 6: Plz no more Jace versions.
nylarotep
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posted April 18, 2013 02:02 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for nylarotep Click Here to Email nylarotep Send a private message to nylarotep Click to send nylarotep an Instant MessageVisit nylarotep's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View nylarotep's Have/Want ListView nylarotep's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by keywacat:
I'm building an extremely aggressive Kaalia deck for 1v1 games using the French rules and have some decisions I'd like community assistance with.

The first question is are 38 lands enough to support Mox Diamond, knowing that 9 of them are 'spell lands' like Maze of Ith, Slayer's Stronghold, etc. For that matter is Lotus Petal better than Mox Diamond if all I want is the possibility of getting Kaalia in play a turn faster?

Also, in general, (heh) in EDH games is Despise better than Duress? (I already have Thoughtseize and don't want to spring 7 USD for Inquisition of Kozilek)

My previous build with this deck was more of a 'Timmy' build with a lot of extra Dragons and Demons that hindsight and a clearer mind shows were not very effective. Hell, I had Ob Nixilis in there with only two fetchlands to accelerate the landfall.


I've had Mox Diamond in decks with 36 or less lands (forget the ratio of mana-producing to utility lands) and haven't really had a problem. Lotus Petal is better for 1-shot acceleration into Kaalia though.

I would run Duress over Despise so that you can strip removal spells for Kaalia.

 
mcelraca
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posted April 18, 2013 02:05 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for mcelraca Click Here to Email mcelraca Send a private message to mcelraca Click to send mcelraca an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by keywacat:
I'm building an extremely aggressive Kaalia deck for 1v1 games using the French rules and have some decisions I'd like community assistance with.

The first question is are 38 lands enough to support Mox Diamond, knowing that 9 of them are 'spell lands' like Maze of Ith, Slayer's Stronghold, etc. For that matter is Lotus Petal better than Mox Diamond if all I want is the possibility of getting Kaalia in play a turn faster?

Also, in general, (heh) in EDH games is Despise better than Duress? (I already have Thoughtseize and don't want to spring 7 USD for Inquisition of Kozilek)

My previous build with this deck was more of a 'Timmy' build with a lot of extra Dragons and Demons that hindsight and a clearer mind shows were not very effective. Hell, I had Ob Nixilis in there with only two fetchlands to accelerate the landfall.


I'll start by saying my Kaliaa deck is very timmy. I did a power deck but recently started getting rid of the better cards bc I've had it since she debuted. The deck is packed with a random assortment of dragons, demons, and angels (Including Ob).

1. I think 27 lands are plenty to work with Mox Diamond.
a.) i look at in the sense that there will be over a 1/4 chance of pulling a land to discard to the diamond.
b.) For edh, at least my play style I'd pick the Diamond over the petal any day. I think the sustained mana output over the game is going to be more beneficial than the no-strings attached 1 mana. I don't think the drawbacks of the diamond are all that bad, especially if you factor in the ability to mulligan. If your taking hands with only "spell lands" you'll probably lose anyway.
---I guess to sum up, I don't think the drawback for the diamond is ever going to be so detrimental that i'd pick lotus petal over it. (For this deck)

2. I like despise personally for edh. I don't play edh competitively. I know there are crazy combos out there for really early kills, but in my experiences most edh decks are built on the backs of creatures. Despise can help you pull those creature combo pieces out early if need be.

3. Do you know the card edgewalker? edgewalker This card gets overlooked a lot, but Kaliaa is a cleric. Edgewalker pulls her cost down to two which is usually enough to get her down and protect her.

 
Sovarius
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posted April 21, 2013 12:41 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Sovarius Send a private message to Sovarius Click to send Sovarius an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Sovarius's Have/Want ListView Sovarius's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by nylarotep:
Don't forget Fury of the Horde and Relentless Assault. Hellkite Charger isn't an Angel but also fits the theme of extra attack steps. Don't forget a decent Sunforger package as well.

Fury of the horde is overpriced (mana/alt cost, not money) and Relentless is by far the weakest of additional combat step cards so i haven't included them so far.
Charger, i'm thinking about it. Since i play for fun though, i may not.
I do have Sunforger of course, i love it. What are some good spells for it to hit though?

quote:
Originally posted by choco man:
I think you're already on your way with most of those things you mentioned.

Definitely, but still need more suggestions because i am always still finding things i haven't heard of before that just sound obvious.
And i appreciate your thought on cutting back on combat step cards since the general has it built in anyway.
More or less sticking with infinite/reusable methods.

So, throwing it out there again i'm still looking for suggestions. Playing a lot of soldiers, so what are the good ones?

Playing tokens, soldiers/angels/humans (to a lesser degree but most soldiers happen to be human anyway), exponential lord effects, extra combat steps, combat tricks, and awesome equipment and equipment related cards.

 
jaromirjagr
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posted April 21, 2013 10:18 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for jaromirjagr Click Here to Email jaromirjagr Send a private message to jaromirjagr Click to send jaromirjagr an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Sovarius

Do you run gisela?kind of an obvious choice although shes an angel.martial coup is a nice wrath if youre running soldiers because it makes soldier tokens.seize the day is a nice extra attack card as well.gratuitious violence is nice too.

 
choco man
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posted April 21, 2013 11:31 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for choco man Click Here to Email choco man Send a private message to choco man Click to send choco man an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View choco man's Have/Want ListView choco man's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by jaromirjagr:
Sovarius

Do you run gisela?kind of an obvious choice although shes an angel.martial coup is a nice wrath if youre running soldiers because it makes soldier tokens.seize the day is a nice extra attack card as well.gratuitious violence is nice too.


Gisela is one of my favorites.

 
nylarotep
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posted April 23, 2013 06:28 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for nylarotep Click Here to Email nylarotep Send a private message to nylarotep Click to send nylarotep an Instant MessageVisit nylarotep's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View nylarotep's Have/Want ListView nylarotep's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by Sovarius:

I do have Sunforger of course, i love it. What are some good spells for it to hit though?

I'd start with Path to Exile and StP. Shattering Pulse, Orim's Thunder, Return to Dust, Rack and Ruin, Chaos Warp, and/or Allay are solid spot removal for other non-creature problem cards.

Enlightened Tutor gives you added search.

Reverberate, Fork, Reiterate, Increasing Vengeance, and Wild Richochet are awesome for copying other's spells.

If you want a subtheme of stealing creatures, you can go with all the red stuff like Grab the Reins, Temporary Insanity, etc.

Don't forget to run Mistveil Plains to reuse all the stuff you grab with the Sunforger.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by nylarotep on April 23, 2013]

 
Sovarius
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posted April 23, 2013 06:56 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for Sovarius Send a private message to Sovarius Click to send Sovarius an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View Sovarius's Have/Want ListView Sovarius's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by jaromirjagr:
Do you run gisela?
martial coup
seize the day
gratuitious violence

Of course Gisela! I love her (and i'm playing every red white legend i think, haha. I am still deciding on whether or not to play double damage effects like Rath, Rage Ref., that curse, etc. And that deliberation is why i haven't gotten Gratuitous Violence.
Martial Coup is exactly what i was looking for but would never have heard of on my own, thanks.
Seize is what i'm looking at for reusasable combat steps, but it is the weakest since it only untaps one creature. if i can't go infinite then at least multiple. Flashback counts, so does World at War (rebound) and Waves of Agression (retrace), Aggravated Assault (enchantment).


quote:
Originally posted by nylarotep:
PtE, Stp.
Shattering Pulse, Orim's Thunder, Return to Dust, Rack and Ruin, Chaos Warp, Allay
Enlightened Tutor
Reverberate, Fork, Reiterate, Increasing Vengeance, and Wild Richochet
Grab the Reins, Temporary Insanity, etc.
Mistveil Plains

PTE and STP are in. Since i can attempt to tutor/recycle my remocal i may stick with just the Thunder, and maybe return to dust.
Enlightened is in.
Copying spells is a decent tutor target. Would most likely only play Ricochet, maybe Reiterate. Reiterate is better than Vengeance since it never gets exiled and can be recycled if not bought back.
I wanted to play all the one-shot control spells. But they don't seem too suitable. I'd want to play Brion Stoutarm with them.
I was thinking of junktroller, i REALLY needed to hear of Mistveil, which can be tutored for itself. Reito Lantern is good though. Recycled broken equipment that i'm playing tutors for.

 
revenger
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posted April 29, 2013 09:38 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for revenger Click Here to Email revenger Click to send revenger an Instant MessageVisit revenger's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View revenger's Have/Want ListView revenger's Have/Want List
I'm back again. After running my Skullbriar edh deck for about 6 months, I'm disappointed with it and want to move on to a new one. I'm looking @ a new commander- Gaddok Teeg. Now this time I have an idea for the deck which didn't really have for Skullbriar deck. This time I'm wanting a G/W Teeg aggro edh deck. Hit em hard. Hit em fast. Brutal. No mercy on the opponent. 40 damage as soon as I can. Anything to win as fast as I can: I guess aggro style. Now- I'm at a loss for spells and/or critters to get this done. Only thing I've figured out so far is land base. Who can help me?

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JoshSherman
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posted April 30, 2013 12:36 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for JoshSherman Click Here to Email JoshSherman Send a private message to JoshSherman Click to send JoshSherman an Instant MessageVisit JoshSherman's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View JoshSherman's Trade Auction or SaleView JoshSherman's Trade Auction or Sale
I had an idea for a deck. Scion of the Ur-Dragon is its general. Here's the concept: Red Dragon

I was going to have the four cards with "cannibal" in their names to really drive home my theme, but meh.

Rounding out the deck:
Abrupt Decay
Argentum Armor
Beast Within
Bramblecrush
Culling Scales
Desert Twister
Filigree Fracture
Karmic Justice
Lux Cannon
Maelstrom Pulse
Nevinyrral's Disk
Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker
Oblivion Stone
Orim's Thunder
Pure//Simple
Rootgrapple
Saltblast
Spine of Ish Sah
Tornado
Vindicate
Violent Ultimatum
Vraska the Unseen
Chaos Warp

Everything else kills stuff. But, stupid me, that's 100 cards with no lands. Looks like I should cut 40 or so dragons. I put this together really quickly, and I'm not terribly interested in refining it right now, but I'll let you know if I come up with something.

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choco man
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posted April 30, 2013 03:42 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for choco man Click Here to Email choco man Send a private message to choco man Click to send choco man an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View choco man's Have/Want ListView choco man's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by revenger:
I'm back again. After running my Skullbriar edh deck for about 6 months, I'm disappointed with it and want to move on to a new one. I'm looking @ a new commander- Gaddok Teeg. Now this time I have an idea for the deck which didn't really have for Skullbriar deck. This time I'm wanting a G/W Teeg aggro edh deck. Hit em hard. Hit em fast. Brutal. No mercy on the opponent. 40 damage as soon as I can. Anything to win as fast as I can: I guess aggro style. Now- I'm at a loss for spells and/or critters to get this done. Only thing I've figured out so far is land base. Who can help me?


If you need a whole decklist worth of creatures, mtgsalvation is the place to go for that.

As we have seen with Sovarius's posts for helping build Aurelia, anything beyond simple card selection questions are very tough to answer. And we all know that deck building is much more complex than just "card A or card B."

If you want MOTL to help build a deck, maybe you could do a "Let's build aggro Gaddock Teeg" thread or sub-thread. Wholesale help with a deck build might work out to be more fun that way.

If you go with the aggro approach, how much haterade do you still want to have in your Teeg.dec? I've seen people go all out super hate and jam every hoser (graveyard, prison effects, etc.); as well as Teeg where he is Voltron; as well as Teeg disguised as combo.

Also, I think it's always easier to just do 21 dmg than 40 dmg. Also also, does it have to be Teeg or did you just want aggro? If you just want something refreshingly aggro and brutal, Edric is the man. You attack with 1/1's all day and WIN.

 
revenger
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posted April 30, 2013 07:43 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for revenger Click Here to Email revenger Click to send revenger an Instant MessageVisit revenger's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View revenger's Have/Want ListView revenger's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by choco man:
If you need a whole decklist worth of creatures, mtgsalvation is the place to go for that.

As we have seen with Sovarius's posts for helping build Aurelia, anything beyond simple card selection questions are very tough to answer. And we all know that deck building is much more complex than just "card A or card B."

If you want MOTL to help build a deck, maybe you could do a "Let's build aggro Gaddock Teeg" thread or sub-thread. Wholesale help with a deck build might work out to be more fun that way. :)

If you go with the aggro approach, how much haterade do you still want to have in your Teeg.dec? I've seen people go all out super hate and jam every hoser (graveyard, prison effects, etc.); as well as Teeg where he is Voltron; as well as Teeg disguised as combo.

Also, I think it's always easier to just do 21 dmg than 40 dmg. Also also, does it have to be Teeg or did you just want aggro? If you just want something refreshingly aggro and brutal, Edric is the man. You attack with 1/1's all day and WIN.


Edric IS the winner. Wow. Wow. Wins consistantly. :D I like it!

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nylarotep
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posted May 03, 2013 07:19 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for nylarotep Click Here to Email nylarotep Send a private message to nylarotep Click to send nylarotep an Instant MessageVisit nylarotep's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View nylarotep's Have/Want ListView nylarotep's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by revenger:
Edric IS the winner. Wow. Wow. Wins consistantly. I like it!


Yeah, I regularly smash 4-man pods with Edric, it's so fun killing someone with Scryb Sprites and Zodiac Rabbit. Only real weaknesses are:

cycled Decree of Pain
Supreme Verdict
Obliterate
Volcanic Fallout
other uncounterable wraths (via Boseiju)

but you can run Stifle/Trickbind/Voidmage Husher/Voidslime to deal with Decree and Wrap in Vigor for the others.

 
choco man
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posted May 03, 2013 08:04 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for choco man Click Here to Email choco man Send a private message to choco man Click to send choco man an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View choco man's Have/Want ListView choco man's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by nylarotep:
Yeah, I regularly smash 4-man pods with Edric, it's so fun killing someone with Scryb Sprites and Zodiac Rabbit. Only real weaknesses are:

cycled Decree of Pain
Supreme Verdict
Obliterate
Volcanic Fallout
other uncounterable wraths (via Boseiju)

but you can run Stifle/Trickbind/Voidmage Husher/Voidslime to deal with Decree and Wrap in Vigor for the others.


It's okay for them to sweep, because you drew 7-8 cards already. And if you happened to draw a Time Warp, it's over. Because of that, I never bother to run but a few counters. I really feel like the only widely played card that gave me trouble was Elesh Norn.

It's also okay because I don't care whether I win or lose as long as it was a good game. Sweep away.

 
revenger
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posted May 03, 2013 09:56 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for revenger Click Here to Email revenger Click to send revenger an Instant MessageVisit revenger's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View revenger's Have/Want ListView revenger's Have/Want List
Yeah Elesh Norn gave me severe probs. Others were- propaganda, tabernacle of pendrel vale (mtgo), and the aura curse card that opponents creatures get -1/-1. Sweep cards arent to bad cuz i know ill have more card drawn again next turn n e ways. Spot removal always on edric is annoying and bad- i overcome it it appears most of the time. I only use a few counters to protect edric and/or protect my lands.

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junichi
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posted May 06, 2013 11:23 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for junichi Click Here to Email junichi Send a private message to junichi Click to send junichi an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I couldn't stop making foil EDH decks. I just finished my third, and will work on my fourth this summer.

Deck building is fun, spending money isn't.

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Devonin
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posted May 06, 2013 11:52 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for Devonin Click Here to Email Devonin Send a private message to Devonin Click to send Devonin an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
Man, the thing about Magic that I am happiest about, is that I managed to not fall victim to the foil bug.
 
choco man
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posted May 06, 2013 12:42 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for choco man Click Here to Email choco man Send a private message to choco man Click to send choco man an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View choco man's Have/Want ListView choco man's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by junichi:
I couldn't stop making foil EDH decks. I just finished my third, and will work on my fourth this summer.

Deck building is fun, spending money isn't.


Do you swap cards between decks?
or
Do you have 4 foil Sol Rings?

 
junichi
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posted May 06, 2013 01:03 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for junichi Click Here to Email junichi Send a private message to junichi Click to send junichi an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by choco man:
Do you swap cards between decks?
or
Do you have 4 foil Sol Rings?

I don't swap, and that is where it hurts. Multiple foil rings, mana crypt, sensei's divining top (I could use another one), etc. I guess the silver lining is, EDH foils tend to keep their value.

edit:
There are situations where I can only optimize one deck and not the other, because I can't afford to own multiple copies of certain cards, such as Workshop.

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[Edited 1 times, lastly by junichi on May 06, 2013]

choco man
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posted May 06, 2013 02:40 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for choco man Click Here to Email choco man Send a private message to choco man Click to send choco man an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View choco man's Have/Want ListView choco man's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by junichi:
I don't swap, and that is where it hurts. Multiple foil rings, mana crypt, sensei's divining top (I could use another one), etc. I guess the silver lining is, EDH foils tend to keep their value.

edit:
There are situations where I can only optimize one deck and not the other, because I can't afford to own multiple copies of certain cards, such as Workshop.


MTG > Food, just eat more instant ramen

If you talked to me 5 yrs ago, I would have happily ate ramen all day every day but things change. At today's prices, you'd have to eat ramen all month every month.

Foils were much cheaper back then. Now that I don't play as much, I don't care as much about foils because I don't care as much about cards. It's also okay to not have an "optimized" deck. When you're playing for fun, you don't nearly miss it as much.

Even before EDH was cool, I only used foil generals and that led to a foil bug. Edric was really the turning point for me. When he was spoiled, I didn't want to play any foils in a deck where the general wasn't foil.

I post this even as I embark on a new journey to foil out Vorel of the Hull Clade.

 
junichi
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posted May 06, 2013 03:14 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for junichi Click Here to Email junichi Send a private message to junichi Click to send junichi an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by choco man:
MTG > Food, just eat more instant ramen

If you talked to me 5 yrs ago, I would have happily ate ramen all day every day but things change. At today's prices, you'd have to eat ramen all month every month.

Foils were much cheaper back then. Now that I don't play as much, I don't care as much about foils because I don't care as much about cards. It's also okay to not have an "optimized" deck. When you're playing for fun, you don't nearly miss it as much.

Even before EDH was cool, I only used foil generals and that led to a foil bug. Edric was really the turning point for me. When he was spoiled, I didn't want to play any foils in a deck where the general wasn't foil.

I post this even as I embark on a new journey to foil out Vorel of the Hull Clade.


Yea, a lot of foil EDH staples have doubled/tripled in price, so I always do a price check on all the cards before I put the deck together. Fortunately for me, other than my Arcum Dagsson deck, my two other EDH decks are very niche, so most of the foils are relatively cheap.

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B14ckM4g3
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posted May 06, 2013 03:17 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for B14ckM4g3 Click Here to Email B14ckM4g3 Send a private message to B14ckM4g3 Click to send B14ckM4g3 an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
So I just posted my decklist here:

http://forums.magictraders.com/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum=Deck+Help+|AMP|+Construction&number=9&DaysPrune=

Would love some opinions on it. I worked pretty hard and could use some suggestions. I followed the french banlist (I believe) and attempted to make it as competetive as possible for 1v1. thanks for the help!

 
nylarotep
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posted May 07, 2013 05:28 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for nylarotep Click Here to Email nylarotep Send a private message to nylarotep Click to send nylarotep an Instant MessageVisit nylarotep's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View nylarotep's Have/Want ListView nylarotep's Have/Want List
quote:
Originally posted by revenger:
Yeah Elesh Norn gave me severe probs. Others were- propaganda, tabernacle of pendrel vale (mtgo), and the aura curse card that opponents creatures get -1/-1. Sweep cards arent to bad cuz i know ill have more card drawn again next turn n e ways. Spot removal always on edric is annoying and bad- i overcome it it appears most of the time. I only use a few counters to protect edric and/or protect my lands.


That's why you hold counters for these cards if you suspect your opponents are playing them. Sweepers aren't good, but assuming you've been sandbagging some weenies, it's easy to recover from. The only land in mine I really care about protecting is Gaea's Cradle, and I run a Strip Mine to deal with other people's problematic lands.

Main gameplan for me is play dudes, draw cards, counter stuff that gets in the way of my gameplan, extra turns, win with Notorious Throng/Beastmaster Ascension.

 
choco man
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posted May 13, 2013 04:20 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for choco man Click Here to Email choco man Send a private message to choco man Click to send choco man an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote View choco man's Have/Want ListView choco man's Have/Want List
Experiences with Ruric Thar yet?

He seems awesome. I set to build a Wort, Raidmother deck until I saw him. I wish he was a beast.

 
junichi
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posted May 15, 2013 10:38 AM   Click Here to See the Profile for junichi Click Here to Email junichi Send a private message to junichi Click to send junichi an Instant Message Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by choco man:
Experiences with Ruric Thar yet?

He seems awesome. I set to build a Wort, Raidmother deck until I saw him. I wish he was a beast.


He looks pretty interesting. Equip him with a Basilisk Collar and it will be a one sided effect.

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WeedIan
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posted May 15, 2013 12:16 PM   Click Here to See the Profile for WeedIan Click Here to Email WeedIan Send a private message to WeedIan Click to send WeedIan an Instant MessageVisit WeedIan's Homepage  Edit/Delete Message Reply With Quote 
I am in the processes of building a deck that will use stuffy doll, spitemare etc cards to do lots of damage to my oppoents (Glissa as a general)

Any suggestions for cards i may not be thinking of

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