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Author Topic:   Need a Ruling?.. Come on in... part 8, the quest for mo answers
purplepat
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posted December 24, 2001 05:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for purplepat   Click Here to Email purplepat     
I have a question about "at the beginning of your upkeep" effects. Stampeding Wildebeests requires you to return a green creature to your hand. Multani's Acolyte has echo. Can you somehow stack these B.O.U. effects to return the Acolyte to your hand each turn and avoid paying the echo cost? This would let you pay GG each turn to recast the Acolyte and draw an extra card each turn.


trax72
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posted December 24, 2001 08:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for trax72     
Shadoa: Abilities on a permanent only apply when they're in play unless otherwise stated on the card. So protection doesn't work while a card is in the graveyard.

purplepat: Yes you can, both abilities trigger at the beginning of upkeep so if you put the Wildebeests' ability on the stack last that will resolve first and allow you to return the Acolyte, after which the echo will resolve but do nothing if you decide not to pay it.

Selvaxri
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posted December 24, 2001 08:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Selvaxri   Click Here to Email Selvaxri     
will cycling a card trigger Megrim?
i'm not totally sure, so a little help would be appreciated.
thanx.


trax72
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posted December 25, 2001 01:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for trax72     
A.11.2 - The ability means "Pay <cost>, discard this card: Draw a card.
Play this ability only when this card is in your hand."
[CompRules 99/04/23]

Yep, looks like that should work.. =)

Shadoa
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posted December 25, 2001 02:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Shadoa   Click Here to Email Shadoa     
Need a sure ruling on standstill. Does the spell have to resolve or does it triger when someone attempts to play a spell? Thanks


iiven
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posted December 25, 2001 08:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for iiven   Click Here to Email iiven     
attempts to play a spell. upon decleration or the spell drawing is done.

if you draw up a counterspell you can counter the spell that allowed you to sac the standstill

Donater
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posted December 27, 2001 03:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Donater   Click Here to Email Donater     
Hi all,
Quick question about Recall.
Is it errated so that you only have to pay XU or did i read it wrong at crystalkeep and you have to pay XXU (thats probably it).
Thx!


da-odd-templar
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posted December 27, 2001 07:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for da-odd-templar   Click Here to Email da-odd-templar     
hehe, I think you forgot an important word...

quote:
The "{X}{X}{U}" casting cost is not a misprint. It means to spend one blue plus two times X generic mana to cast the spell. [Duelist Magazine #2, Page 7] See Rule K.27.2.

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Rocket's Zapdos
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posted December 27, 2001 09:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rocket's Zapdos   Click Here to Email Rocket's Zapdos     
what happens when my Goblin Legionnare blocks a 2/2 creature (so 2/2 angainst a 2/2)is it alright for me to use the abilty and not take damage say it does 2 damage to two targets?

Can I get a simple explanation of "the stack"

trax72
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posted December 28, 2001 02:39 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for trax72     
Once you block, you can use either ability of Goblin Legionairres without receiving damage to yourself. This is even the case if you do this before combat damage is assigned and put on the stack, since the attacking creature will still be considered blocked and won't be able to damage you unless it has trample or an ability like Rhox. You would usually do this after combat damage is on the stack, that way you can kill the attacking creature if it has a toughness of 4, for example.


da-odd-templar
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posted December 28, 2001 05:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for da-odd-templar   Click Here to Email da-odd-templar     
quote:
Originally posted by Rocket's Zapdos:
Can I get a simple explanation of "the stack"

That, my friend, is impossible.

__________________
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Valmtg is my Goddess.


Rocket's Zapdos
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posted December 28, 2001 09:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rocket's Zapdos   Click Here to Email Rocket's Zapdos     
what cards can destroy a creature with gettingaround protection is earthquake one?

When does the stack empty or starts activating?

SonOfYawgmoth
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posted December 28, 2001 10:27 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SonOfYawgmoth   Click Here to Email SonOfYawgmoth     
Any non targeted, not damage form of removal.
Wrath of God, Innocent Blood, Rout, etc. Earthquake is not a way. It deals damage.

I'm not great with the stack but I'll give it a try. =/
When you play a spell, it immediately goes on the stack. Your opponents then have a chance to respond to your play. When all the spells and stuff are done, the stack starts to empty. First in, last out.

I sure do suck at explaining

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iiven
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posted December 28, 2001 10:43 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for iiven   Click Here to Email iiven     
ok ok ok ok. THE STACK!

ive had 2 experiences with the stack, magic and programming. so i will attempt to explain it


when you play a spell (lets call this Spell A)

your place A on the stack

So at this point the stack looks like this

STACK
A

your opponent may then respond by playing a spell or ability (Lets call this Spell B)

So now the stack looks like this (Remember nothing has resolved yet)

STACK

B
A

You may then respond (Spell C)

STACK

C
B
A

And so on. each player continueing to respond with spells and such.

now when all players are done playing spells the stack "resolves"

you take it from top to bottom

So if the stack looks like this

STACK
C
B
A

first C resolves. then B resolves. Then A resolves.

it runs on a first in last out basis. hence the name stack. you keep placing spells on top until no one else wants to play any spells. then it empties top to bottom.


trax72
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posted December 28, 2001 11:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for trax72     
That explanation of the stack is not quite complete I'm afraid...

At the beginning of any step within the turn except untap and normally cleanup, the active player gets priority first to play spells or abilities. That player can play as many spells or abilities as he wants which go on the stack in the order they are played, before passing priority to the other player who can then do the same. When both players pass priority, the topmost spell/ability resolves after which the active player gets priority again.

This continues until the stack is empty, and the step ends when both players pass with an empty stack.

You should really read through http://www.wizards.com/dci/oracle/MagicCompRules_092401.txt a few times. It might be a bit hard at times but it's very beneficial.

Rocket's Zapdos
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posted December 28, 2001 11:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rocket's Zapdos   Click Here to Email Rocket's Zapdos     
thanks for clearing that up another question
when do you luse cards that return creatures such as aether burst, unsummon, repulse.


Sunrunner
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posted December 28, 2001 12:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Sunrunner   Click Here to Email Sunrunner     
I'm not sure what you mean by "luse" or lose, but if you mean when they are returned to your hand, they lose all enchantments, counters and other permanants effects on them.

So if you have a Phyrexian Scuta in play, kicked, with an Unholy Strength on it, and say Unsummon returns it to your hand, the Unholy Strength goes to your graveyard and the +1/+1 counters on it are removed from the game. If you want it to be a 5/5 again when you cast it, you'll have to pay the kicker again.

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Donater
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posted December 28, 2001 03:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Donater   Click Here to Email Donater     
Thx da Odd Templar...i think i drunk too much when i posted it
Thx


moxdiamd
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posted December 28, 2001 07:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for moxdiamd   Click Here to Email moxdiamd     
This may have been answered in the other 11 pages, but I dont want to go throught them all to find out. If a creature with a kicker comes into play other then casting, such as oath of druids, can you pay the kicker cost to gain the kicker effect?


Sunrunner
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posted December 28, 2001 08:10 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Sunrunner   Click Here to Email Sunrunner     
Well let's see, on Phyrexian Scuta (man this can be used for lots of examples lol) the parenthises state:

"You may pay 3 life in addition to any other costs as you play this spell."

Now I'm not 100% sure on this one, but I think the answer to Oath of Druids is no.

1. For one, you are not playing this "spell".

2. It is not being played as your spell. Which would mean that to be your spell, it would have to be cast from your hand by paying its total mana cost. (Including other effects such as Jet Medallion, Sphere of resistance, etc.)

Once the spell is being cast, you then have the opportunity to pay the kicker of 3 life before the spell is successfully cast, which is a bitch nowadays with Absorb and Undermine and Memory Lapse and other counterspells running rampant, because if they do counter it, you paid the kicker for no god damned reason.

[rambling]
But now I'm getting way ahead of myself, answering questions that weren't even asked...

Ugh, I must talk too much when people ask me rulings in real life...need sleep....[/rambling]

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"Don't mourn for me. This is my destiny."
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MyKoL
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posted December 28, 2001 09:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MyKoL   Click Here to Email MyKoL     
quote:
Originally posted by moxdiamd:
This may have been answered in the other 11 pages, but I dont want to go throught them all to find out. If a creature with a kicker comes into play other then casting, such as oath of druids, can you pay the kicker cost to gain the kicker effect?


nope. Only when you cast something you can play the kickercost.

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gotin_ss
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posted December 29, 2001 12:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for gotin_ss   Click Here to Email gotin_ss     
as a judge, all these questions are very easy


trax72
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posted December 29, 2001 01:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for trax72     
What's your point? Besides, there's plenty of judges out there that make stupid mistakes.


da-odd-templar
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posted December 29, 2001 01:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for da-odd-templar   Click Here to Email da-odd-templar     
quote:
Originally posted by gotin_ss:
as a judge, all these questions are very easy

Maybe instead of putting down people for asking "easy" questions, you can help out trax72 and the rest of the people on this thread by answering questions whenever you get the chance. Sheesh.

And trust me, not all judges judge perfectly.

There are MANY players who are not judges but because they are want to excell at the game, learn all the rules. Most of these players know alot more about the rules than some of the judges I've seen. I am not trying to diminish the judges on MOTL. KIP_NZ, coolio, trax72 (you a judge yet?), gzeiger (same for you), and everybody else - keep up the good work!

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Stinky cheese is still cheese.

Last night I stayed up late playing poker with Tarot cards. I got a full house and four people died. - Stephen Wright

Rice Cube - The next Azn Sensation!

Proud member of The Rice Collective!

Valmtg is my Goddess.


[Edited 1 times, lastly by da-odd-templar on December 29, 2001]


trax72
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posted December 29, 2001 02:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for trax72     
Me = Lv. 0 Judge.


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